Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-26213507-20150715194939/@comment-26356342-20150925053651

Bronkiin wrote: I'm saying that such terms are symptomatic of an attitude prevalent throughout all of Tamriel. Secondly, the term is used to refer to someone not from the same land of origin, as opposed to race. I Understand that very well, its a common theme within the Elder scrolls. Bretons of High Rock, Dunmer of Morrowind, each race seemed to get assigned a region, and all of them have their issues with other races. However, 2 counter points to this. 1. Nothing you stated makes what Galmar said any less Xenophobic. 2. The Empire is accepting of all races, which is supposed to be (part of) the direct contrast between the 2 factions.

I know you acknowledged it, but I'll reiterate that Galmar sending the Dragonborn on a suicide mission is in no way shape or form related to race.

Technically I said he will still test a Nord so it's not necessarily bound to race, it is odd he has race specific dialog. Why would it matter why "a cat" wants to fight for Skyrim and the stormcloaks? Why is that even a question?

The Nords are far more aggressively outspoken; blunt as they are in most things.

I understand perfectly well, the differences between our real world society and that of the Fantasy one we're discussing, It wasnt a direct correlation,If the Nords are in fact "blunt" why was it his answer wasn't just "yes" or "no" he had to hide it beneath layers of extra explanation and ends with telling you to read more history. It's a simple and basic question, even for their race and the society they're in "do you or do you not trust non-nords?" and as far as I'm concerned any answer that isn't "no" is admitting "yes".

To make your choice in the Civil War based on who seems more tolerant in a world where distrust of the unknown is so omniscient is very misguided.

Tullius is pulled away from home to a place completely foreign to him, and yes at first he is a little stand-off-ish to the new customs he has to learn and he's being blunt when asking questions (the same thing you just praised the nords for when they weren't blunt). By the end of the quest it's well known he's become receptive and accepting to his new life in Skyrim, and has grown to respect the Nords living there.

And yes, why not choose tolerance? What good does making enemies of other races based ONLY on their race? Part of what makes the Empire great is the fact it can use the best out of each race and utilize them all together for a common goal. Things have been bad for them recently, Yeah I admit that, but without Conflict there is no game. The overall point I was making to begin with was directed at someone who asked me for specifics on how the stormcloaks appear racist.

What is with all this talk about things being the same? the Empire was mostly not involved with the goings on of Skyrim, and if winning the Civil war has put people in charge who want to make change, and as we see with brunwulf, is actively trying to change things.

To base your decision on the Civil War on who is or is not "racist", in the realities of Tamriel, is sheer folly. I'll say again: the debate needs to lie in the question of best outcome. Which outcome will leave Skyrim in the best position to fend off the Thalmor threat?

You can somehow see things will never change, and yet you think the racism within the stormcloaks wont effect the outcome, and ultimately decide if their in a better position? Come now... That racism is a part of the Stormcloaks and directly affects their position post civil war. That Racism and nationalism and xenophobia means they wont be asking for help at all. That means it's not even just SKyrim vs the Dominion, it's JUST THE NORDS of Skyrim, vs the dominion. They have enough trouble getting non-nords to fight as it stands now, and as I pointed out the game points out several times with just the stormcloaks race is a big part of their whole situation. Race is brought up way more then it should... SO if the question really is who is in the best position, I'd say the side with xenophobia that costs them men (which you need to build a large enough army to fight the dominion) wouldn't be the right choice.

But for the record, it's not ENTIRELY what I based my decision on. I personally have several. Starting with the tolerance for magic, the (IMO) bettwer Jarls, the NOT losing an economy, the larger army when fighting the dominion, and ending at that nationalism. It is a minor part to a bigger picture.