Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-1600847-20161103125247/@comment-993964-20161109065040

YinyangElementofduality wrote: Sports72Xtrm wrote: 1. Except the Empire is still unprepared even if they do win the Skyrim Civil War. They were roped into signing a treaty where they Thalmor get to incriminate the Empire's citizens and use it as an excuse to sabotage the Empire at their leisure. The White Gold Concordant allows the Thalmor to infiltrate imperial lands, spread propaganda and turn the populace against an already unpopular empire, recruit other assets, and just let the Empire spend its resources on quelling unrest and other Thalmor agents. If the Empire couldn't get its shit together before the Civil War, it's not going to get its shit together after having exhausted its resources on an uprising and with the Thalmor having more of an excuse to breathe down their necks.

2. One cherry picked battle where fortune just happens to shine on the Empire isn't a formula to determine the fate of a war. The Great War was filled with battles that were won and lost; and where the head generals had close brushes with death. But war has many variables. To Tullius' credit, he does seem like a problem fixer of the Empire, and a 4 star general badass. But so is Ulfric. Ulfric took out the Forsworn uprising with just his militia. I say that also earned him his stars and stripes. Difference is, Ulfric is a man in his prime, a warrior with the Thuum, and a 4 star general badass and doesn't stop fighting until the blood in heart stops pumping. Tullius is an old man, maybe a strategist, but an old man all the same, that despaired when things looked bleak. Saying the Empire is better military seems like it's a skewed projection of your bias. The Stormcloaks are able to do just as well as the Imperials, but their leaders have the nerve to do what needs to be done. I can't say the same for the Imperials. Ulfric is not a man of his prime. He has thu'u m without a doubt because without it, he cannot even defeat a kid with no combat experience. Ulfric couldn't have been younger than 18 when he fought in the Great War. By the end of Great War, he can't be younger than 25 and 25 years have passed since the Great War ended, meaning Ulfric is not going to be in his prime for much longer. Civil War will likely take about 2 years to finish, he cannot be younger than 52 by then, by the time he reach the next Great War he cannot be younger than 53. Chances Ulfric is older is almost 100%.

You are the only one talking about one cherry. You appear to be too blind to see that the Imperials are very much capable of having the 'nerve' as you said... to do what needs to be done.

They were pretty much kicking the ass of Stormcloaks until the Dragonborn helped the Stormcloaks. Ulfric is no equivalent to Tullius for sure. I only have 2 instance to go for Tullius, both had him winning. One is outsmarting Ulfric and nearly killing him, the other is having a better battle plans as the Imperials were slaughtering the Stormcloaks. Said by Tullius when asked how goes the battle, confirmed by Galmar and Ulfric about their men getting slaughtered.

Wrong, I am the most qualified person to say I have no biased and I am the most qualified person to decide if you have bias or not. You only see this as biased because you are bias yourself and see anything, even unbiased facts as bias if it doesn't favor your preferred side.

Those are facts that Tullius is superior than Ulfric and Tullius belongs to the Empire. Problem solver or no, he is part of the Empire's strength. Tullius gains 2 wins against Ulfric in battle of strategy.

Now an unbiased look at Ulfric's tactical track record.

Ulfric participated in the Great War. Captured by Thalmor he lost this one.

Ulfric succeeded in defeating the Forsworn in Markarth years ago. Ulfric won this one.

Ulfric got captured by Tullius in the Ambush, Ulfric lost this one, as he could not have escaped without any external help.

Ulfric's men were getting slaughtered by Tullius. Ulfric lost this one as there was no actual follow up except words to overturn the advantage.

Ulfric vs Tullius is a 3/7. Reasoning is Ulfric had 1 major and 1 minor loss out of 2 known engagements with Tullius. I don't care if you think Ulfric's Thuum is a dirty trick or irrelevant, with it he was able to take Markarth from an army. Markarth is a stone fort where jarls in charge there wasn't even afraid of dragons. For Ulfric to take that city says something. Tullius' biggest military accomplishment is an ambush against a few Stormcloak bodyguards protecting Ulfric in open field, without defenses, without Ulfric's army. The Thalmor doesn't care about your posturing, doesn't care if you think magic is a dirty trick, it will break the Empire because the Empire is fragile and weak and they don't want to admit it.