Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-26213507-20150715194939/@comment-26356342-20150825172621

Ottoman Hold wrote: S&#039;Dalaar the Snowcat wrote:

But that's just the thing! They don't want to let go of Skyrim. They want those resources, as well as their military support. The Empire left Hammerfell because it was a part of WGC. But they have no reason to let go of Skyrim. Especially not because of  Ulfric. The Empire could care less about him. If Ulfric would try to amass an army against the Dominion, he would have been declared a traitor and the Empire would have put a stop to it for their own interests. Pretty much just like in the rebellion against the Empire. The way I see it, a bloody conflict could not have been avoided not matter what they did. The Imperial's selfish interests prevents all forms of a peaceful seceding. Although they want the resources, I don't beleive they would war with Skyrim just for that. They would let them go, just like hammerfell, to avoid losing men for the imminent Great War 2: The Even Greater War. Everyone in Skyrim who supported the legion may move away or decide to join the Stormcloaks, who in this case, did not kill Torygg or start a war. I don't really see why The Empire would have to put an end to Skyrim, since it is no longer part of it. I also don't remember there being a part in the WGC about The Empire needing to go to every providence and kill all Talos worshipers. Again, if they succeed peacefully, Skyrim is a useful ally during the war, since there are no hard feelings, unlike Hammerfell. Well, heres the thing. Ulfric had his militia up and running by 4E 176, when the Empire was signing the WGC (I'd question how Ulfric managed to essentially raise a legion of soldiers when they would have been better used to fight thalmor but thats for another time) and He was retaking markarth. This is where things become murkey... The Empire showed up to restore order, they're still pretty fresh from the great war, and trying to just maintain control, Ulfric using his posistion as savior to his advantage makes the empire swear they'll allow free talos worship or else he wont let them in. They JUST signed that WGC, and Ulfric is basically holding a city hostage to get the Empire to agree to break the terms. How much easier it would have been to just hand the city back over to the Empire, and just scoff at the Empire's inability to maintain control in the region. Then focus the milita on specifically Thalmor agents and activities. You would have had an entire region saying the Stormcloaks were the only ones doing anything about the Thalmor threat. Pressure would have come down from the Dominion onto the Empire to maintain control, and if the Empire were to openly attack the Stormcloaks, it would have painted them as the enemy. If the Stormcloaks ONLY killed Thalmor and saving citizens from Thalmor, and suddenly the Empire comes in and fights them, they would have lost ALL control. No matter how dumb you think the Empire is, theres no way they would have agreed to attack the stormcloaks (thereby losing all trust from the common people and nobles alike) which means the only other option would have been to let go of Skyrim completely. jumped ahead 25 years to 4E 201 and Ulfric is challenging Torygg to a duel, kills him, then flees back to Windhelm. This is totally unnecessary. This would have been plenty of time for the Thalmor to take root in Skyrim and a perfect opportunity for Ulfric to appear like a holy crusader. You have the Markarth Incident, where he trys to maintain open worship of Talos, then he's arrested, released, made Jarl (technically he was made jarl while in prison) and his first act ISNT an attack on the Thalmor Embassy? but instead to the High King? Why? to prove he's better? to prove the empire makes them weak? or other such nonsense. He should have taken the direct approach and attacked every Thalmor he could get his hands on. How amazing would the Duel between Torygg and Ulfric have been, had Torygg tried to ORDER Ulfric to stop killing THALMOR so Ulfric duels him for the throne? Doesn't THAT send a better message? The story wouldn't have been ulfric just marching in and killing the young king, it would have been the High King making a demand that conflicts with the interest of the nation and being dethroned because of it. and that would have only been one of the wost case scenarios, as the best case scenarios would have involved the High King joining Ulfric. Ulfric had plenty of time to amass and organize his milita only to take it out on the wrong target. Even with how angry and betrayed he felt towards the Empire if he outright refused to fight Imperial forces, the people would just see the Empire attempting to slaughter their only saviors, and good luck maintaining control after that. The Empire HAS to react to something such as someone attacking the High King of their province, and they HAVE to attempt to maintain control of lands they currently own. But they wouldn't have had to do that, had Ulfric not attacked the Empire.