Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-13417807-20130726204600/@comment-135.19.47.8-20130911173403

Zippertrain85 wrote: 135.19.47.8 wrote: Zippertrain85 wrote: 135.19.47.8 wrote: Zippertrain85 wrote: 135.19.47.8 wrote: Zippertrain85 wrote: 135.19.47.8 wrote: The Thalmor WANT the Stormcloaks to win, even if it meant their embassy would swin in angry nords possesed of an iron will to burn it down. They know Ulfric's men couldn't take on their army, unlike the Empire, who can call upon reinforcements from High Rock.

Imperials are naturals when it comes to serving as shock troops and Bretons and resist magic, in addition to being gifted in the magical arts themselves.

Nords serve better as light infantry or militia--no magical resistance and no heavy infantry, only bloodthirsty rebels wearing chainmail and leather, while Imperials posses an inborn ability to wear heavy armor and cast restoration spells.

Defending a nation from foreign occupiers is one thing. Digging its grave is another. The Stormcloaks could get help from other nations with similar goals, like Hammerfell and Morrowind. Ulfric also offered an alliance with High Rock already.

No magical resistance? If you played Skyrim you would know they have 50% resistance to frost, that's including magic. Nords have also used heavy armor numerous times with success and respect Restoration magic. When's the last time you saw a Stormcloak use Close Wounds or Healing Hands or any other restoration spells? Maybe if you count their Battle-Maidens, but even then, they'll need a lot more of them. None of them wear heavy armour, either.

Nothing proves High Rock is even remotely interested in allying with Ulfric and Morrowind doesn't really care, they've got their own problems. Hammerfell? Maybe, but they'd still need more. The Redguards beat the Aldmeri using guerilla warfare tactics and knowledge of the terrain, on top of the ennemy seeing their repeated requests for reinforcements denied.

Morrowind is out of the game: most of it is still covered in ash or rubble due to Argonian raids. Also, the Dunmer are elves, so they probably won't be annihilated by the Dominion. It's been heavily implied Battle-Maidens use Restoration magic. Just like it's heavily implied there are female Imperial soldiers. I bet they could train regular soldiers too. Gameplay doesn't equal lore.

Skyrim has problems too. Once they see how big the Dominion's threat is they will probably join. The Dominion is very low on soldiers. Realistically speaking just the Nords and the Redguards could probably beat the Dominion.

Only Vvardenfell is covered in ashes. And they're currently rebuilding the destroyed cities. Haven't spoken to Malborn I see. According to him the Dunmer hate the Dominion. They probably consider Daedra worshippers to be just as bad as Talos worshippers. -The Dunmer don't care much for the Thalmor...That doesn't necessarily mean they hate the Dominion, only that they don't care about them. I don't think they care about the Empire, either. If you help the Imperials in the Civil War and conquer Riften, some of the legionnaires will say that the Empire should invade Morrowind. This suggests that Morrowind answers only to itself. Like I said, they have their own problems.

Realistically speaking, the Thalmor could always call upon Bosmeri and Khajiit forces to aid them in their fight. Valenwood and Elsweyr are client states after all. Plus, the Dominion excells at something that the Redguards and Nords don't: divide et impera--divide and conquer. They would simply invade Hammerfell from one side and Skyrim from another, splitting the herd. Don't forget that the Stormcloaks will probably burn down the Thalmor Embassy almost immediatly after winning the war, so the Thalmor would invade them first, preventing them from calling upon allies.

I don't support the Empire because I'm a blind Imperial-sympathizer. I support them because it's the most effective solution.

The Thalmor are cleansing Valenwood, so many Bosmer, such as Malborn, are beginning to work against them. The Empire could exploit that to their advantage. With a rebellion in its hands, the Dominion will focus on the Bosmeri homeland. While they're distracted, you do what they did in Skyrim: provide indirect support to seperatist forces, all the while dividing a solution to snatch Elsweyr from the Thalmor's hands. An alliance with Hammerfell would be beneficial, since Breton wizards could accompany them and place themselves in the lenght of water between Alinor and Valenwood/Elsweyr, disrupting reinforcements and supply shipments to and from the client states.

Okay, I'm just thinking aloud here, but point is: a united Empire (preferably with a new emperor... a competent emperor) is the best long-term choice. I know the Dunmer hate the Empire. They've been having trouble with the Altmer for a long time. As I said, Daedra worship is not looked upon well at all in Altmeri culture. The Stormcloaks share almost all of their beliefs. Why wouldn't they help them.

Actually, realistically speaking neither of them would help the Thalmor. The Bosmer are treated horribly by the Thalmor. Delphine says they are "purged" by them. And as shown by Malborn and Brelas they're looked upon as lowly servents. The Khajiits don't care about the Dominion's beliefs. They only follow them because they brought back the moons. The government wouldn't want to use their armies to fight in a cause they don't care about at all.

And why couldn't the Stormcloaks? You act like this is Empire exclusive, but it's not. The Stormcloaks are actually more likely to do this since the Empire has pissed off a lot of different provinces, and making an alliance after these betrayals happened so recently would be very hard. The Stormcloaks are the best hope for unity in Tamriel. You're right about the Empire frustrating a lot people. You're also right about Deadra worship. But you are wrong about Stormcloaks uniting Tamriel. If anything, they'll divide it.

In a dream-like scenario, Skyrim bands with Hammerfell over their common hatred for the Dominion. High Rock refuses to be part of a two-province empire or is being pressured/menaced by the new alliance. They finnaly cave in and become part of the.. say, Dragonborn Pact. In honour to the man/woman who made it possible.

Cyrodiil is left alone. In a similar scenario, they may as well ally with Black Marsh, but that doesn't seem likely. I'd bet good coin on the Argonians staying out of it. Morrowind doesn't have much to spare, so they'll probably only act if one of the three parties approaches them. Though, for the sake of this argument, let's say they both join the Empire.

Dragonborn Pact: Impressive melee combat prowess (Nords & Redguards) combined with magical affinity (Bretons).

Empire: Moderate melee combat prowess (Imperials), magical affinity (Dunmer) and excellent use of guerilla warfare tactics (Argonians).

Dominion: Most powerful wizards in Tamriel (Altmer), great archers (doubt the Bosmer will just stand by if Valenwood is invaded) and profficient warriors (same with Khajiit, they love the Thalmor for lying to their face).

I'd say they're all well-balanced. In THIS scenario, I'd put my money on Dragonborn Pact. Otherwise, I still think the Empire quells the rebellion and manages to find a way to ally with Hammerfell *without* conquering it. If the latter occurs, I'll go with Empire.

Actualy... wait. Isn't there something similar in The Elder Scrolls Online? How would they divide it? When you consider all of this, I just don't see why you would help the Legion, when you could get the same results with the Stormcloaks, except it ensured they'll fight the Dominion. I said this was a dream-like scenario, meaning that it could only happen if pigs starting flying and the sky turned pink. If it does, let me know.

On a more realistic note, it's obvious the Empire is the best choice for a second round with the Thalmor. Nords, Redguard and Imperials charging the ennemy, Bretons supplementing them with magical protection and Bosmeri rebels hitting them from the back.

Anyway, it's not like either of us is going to change things. Let Bethesda figure it out.