Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-209.7.3.188-20160303204000/@comment-30030894-20161024072046

Sports72Xtrm wrote:

The Aspect Of Akatosh wrote:

Sports72Xtrm wrote:

Blademaster Jauffre wrote:

Sports72Xtrm wrote: How can you deny that the Imperials aren't responsible for the Talos ban. There's actually a book called the The Talos Mistake that reads:

"But the citizens of the Empire must know this: the Emperor did not agree to outlaw the worship of Talos because it was demanded by the Thalmor, the ruling body of the Aldmeri Dominion.

The Emperor agreed to the outlaw of the worship of Talos because it was the right thing to do.

Today, the Emperor, and indeed the Empire itself, recognizes that allowing the worship of Talos was a mistake. For by doing so, by allowing the worship of Talos as a Divine the Empire actually did its own people a great disservice: for this only succeeded in weakening the memory of the man Tiber Septim and his many extraordinary (though mortal) deeds; and pushing people away from the Eight Divines, the true gods, who do deserve our love and reverence.

And so, the Empire admits it was wrong. The Talos Mistake will not be repeated. May we find centuries of peace and prosperity with our new Thalmor friends, and continue to share a spirituality that binds together all the cultures and races of Tamriel."

Not only did the emperor encourage the ban becoming law, not only is it illegal in Imperial provinces, but he actually wrote a book that details his full support of the Thalmor's philosophy. The Emperor and his Empire are the ones with "Thalmor friends" but you accuse Ulfric of being their agent? How do we get to this conclusion?

And the Redguards spit on the Empire after they abandoned them and sold their provinces to the Thalmor. They fought for the freedom of their province by themselves, they never acknowledged that they needed to unite under the Empire. This book was written by a Thalmor agent, Imperial laison to the Aldmeri Dominion. The book is merely a way to ensure the peace will last for long enough, did you look at who the author was? She's an   Imperial Liaison to the  Aldmeri Dominion Doesn't that say enough?

The Empire has no love for the Thalmor. -Vittoria Vici

How do we get to this conclusion?

1. Talos ban wasn't enforced in Skyrim.

2. Ulfric demanded free Talos worship in exchange for retaking the Reach.

3. Suddenly the Thalmor found out about it and came to Skyrim.

4. The Thalmor demand Ulfric to be arrested and start enforcing the Talos ban.

5. Suddenly Ulfric becomes uncooperative to the Thalmor and starts a rebellion.

Do you really not see it?

'' The Redguards say that this proves that the White-Gold Concordat was unnecessary, and that if Titus II had kept his nerve, the Aldmeri could have been truly defeated by the combined forces of Hammerfell and the rest of the Empire. '' -The Great War

The Redguards acknowledge that the Empire is needed, despite their hatred. 1. The Author of The Talos Mistake is an Imperial diplomat of the Empire, not an Altmer of the Dominion. Leonora Venatus, Imperial Liaison to the Aldmeri Dominion, speaks on behalf of the Emperor and the Empire, not on behalf of the Dominion. Unless you're saying that the Emperor's men are Thalmor agents, as much as it would be tempting for me to agree, I think you give them too much credit. They lack the premeditative foresight and competency to do such a dastardly thing. The Thalmor's dupes, is more apt. Furthermore, to publicly announce their support of the Thalmor's agenda to rid Talos of his deity status in a publication is the Emperor publicly broadcasting him spitting in the face of every Talos worshiper, which they had to know comprises of a significant portion of their empire. Did the Empire not think that this public political statement would be interpreted as any other way other than the Emperor and the Empire so whipped by the Dominion and turning its back on humanity?

2. The Empire did enforce the Talos ban. ex.: Balgruuf: "I won't say it again, Vignar; Talos worship is forbidden. It's the Empire's law, and we're still a part of the Empire."

Vignar: "A law made at the tip of an Aldmeri sword, aye. A sword stained red with Nord blood. Is this what our people fought and died for? To forsake our most beloved ancestor and divine?"

Balgruuf: "I'm no happier about this than you are, but I don't want the [sic] see the Thalmor rounding up people in the streets and throwing them in prison."

Vignar: "Do your loyalties lie with the Thalmor, then?" Balgruuf: "I warn you, Gray-Mane, you are treading on dangerous ground."

Vignar: ""Don't threaten me, boy. You're either a Nord who respects our traditions, or you're not. If not, it isn't me you'll have to answer to, but the people of this city and this Hold."

Talos worship is equivalent to being associated with the Stormcloaks and even the Dragonborn was about to be unjustly executed for being labeled a criminal through association. The Empire either executes you for worshipping Talos if you get caught or sell you to the Thalmor to appease their inquisition. Seems to me, the Legionaire supporters aren't on the same page as their emperor as the book I cited is his public declaration that the Thalmor are the Empire's friends and are completely right in them abducting Talos worshipers and torturing them in their own homeland! To the Empire, his Talos worshiping subjects are Stormcloak rebels worthy of execution.

3. The Redguards never said they needed the Empire. They said the Empire could have won the Great War but surrendered because they lack the nerve. And history proved them correct, the Redguards took back Hammerfall without Imperial support. I have to bring this up. When you say the Imperials are against Talos, they aren't. They worship Talos. One of the people who became Talos founded their Empire. If you do the Imperial questline, you'd know they worship Talos. Nord Imps like the Lt. Rikke worship Talos under their breath. It still doesn't change the fact that it is outlawed, something to be ashamed of, and publicly frowned upon by the Emperor himself. The current Emperor challenges the notion that Talos is truly a deity, and those that support the Mede dynasty thus support heresy. Talos is the human god of war and triumphalism is he not? Do you think the God of War appreciates the lip service of followers who worships in secret to appease their enemies? I expect a certain degree of pride in their traditions, otherwise it seems like the Nords in the Imperial Legion who praise Talos under their breath is a bastardization of proper worship.

Furthermore, if Talos is truly the god of governance, how can true Talos worshipers not get the hint that if Talos is truly divine, he clearly does not favor the Medes or the Empire. Just compare the provinces in the Empire during the Septim line, and the provinces who left the Empire and are currently under Mede rule. Didn't Talos came to Morrowind in his Avatar form and said the Emperor, Imperial Legion and the Empire were getting old, it was time for something new.

I think Talos wants a change in governing System. Not just in names only.