Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-209.7.3.188-20160303204000/@comment-30011802-20161103013330

How Roigvar was inocent!

Thought I’d take the time to address this execution. First, lets start out with why Roggvir is being executed.

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Roggvir was charged with treason for letting Ulfric go out the gates of Solitude, right? Well first, lets look at the obvious. There are two gates to the city of Solitude:

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So right off the bat, we have a problem. There should be at LEAST two if not more guards guarding the gates to the biggest city in Skyrim, right? So, why is Roggvir the only person being executed?

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Second point, the duel was accepted by the High King, and the court watched as it happened right? So what happened after he was dead? Did Ulfric flee as they said they did? If he did flee, that would mean guards were called to apprehend him right? And if they were…how did Ulfric manage to get all the way through the biggest city in Skyrim on foot with a bunch of angry guards chasing him?

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I don’t think they did call the guards, because if they did, Ulfric would have been apprehended. And if they did, one of the guards surely would have stopped Ulfric at the gates. Why? Because they didn’t see the duel! They didn’t know what happened! You can’t guard a gate and be in the Blue Palace courtyard! So Roggvir didn’t even know what happened! If there were guards chasing Ulfric, he’d have certainly stopped him because he’d have no idea what he did and would assume he committed a crime.

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This means that the court and Solitude must have recognized that the King accepted a duel by Nord law, and they all let Ulfric go. If so, then the Imperials probably came later and told them they were dumb asses for letting him go, and that Imperial law makes it illegal. Elisif likely was only too happy to say it was murder instead of a duel, and then put blame on Roggvir so Solitude didn’t look bad. Think about it, the Empire never mentions a duel, and when Sybille mentions it, she lies and says Torygg was shouted apart, but Ulfric tells us the truth. For those who don’t trust Ulfric’s word, here’s the developer notes on Sybille’s dialogue:

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">http://cs.uesp.net/index.php?game=sr&formid=0x000c07ee

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">Roggvir probably didn’t find out till later what Ulfric did. This clearly is pointing to Roggvir being innocent of the charges of treason, and the Empire executed an innocent man. Disagree? Well ask yourself. Why wasn’t Elisif’s court or Elisif herself in trouble? Obviously because the Empire needs them. Well why wasn’t there at least a second guard executed? Even if you think Ulfric was running from guards, you can’t get around that. Ulfric was not being chased, and the guards at the gate did not know the king was killed. As I said, if Ulfric was being chased, they’d have stopped him by default because of their lack of knowledge on the situation, and if they did know and let him loose, there should be other guards charged with treason.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">If you think Ulfric walked out the door by the bridge inside the city, that isn’t a gate, and no guards patrol that door. Bottom line, Solitude recognized Ulfric’s legal duel, let him go, then when the Empire came around to start pointing the finger, Elisif’s court pointed the finger at the guards, and the guards pointed the finger at Roggvir. Sad story, truly.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">The Empire allows laws when it suits them, and only when it suits them. The killing of Torygg was not something they wanted, so they chose to get involved instead of letting the moot commence. If you think they had no choice, I wouldn’t disagree necessarily, as allowing Ulfric to secede Skyrim would be an unrealistic expectation. But then, that’s what I would have said about them letting the Thalmor arrest citizens. They claimed to do that for the greater good, so why not let Skyrim secede and then be allies with them for the greater good? After all, they allowed slavery in Morrowind because it benefited them:

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">.

<p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;color:rgb(204,204,204);font-family:"HelveticaNeue",Helvetica,Arial,"LucidaGrande",sans-serif;font-size:16px;font-weight:normal;">http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Armistice <p style="margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:16px;">Additionally, and perhaps most importantly in the minds of Dunmer elites, the practice of slavery in Morrowind was protected by the Empire.<span class="reference" id="cite_ref-BB_10-0" style="font-size:12px;line-height:0;position:relative;top:-0.5em;">[11]