User talk:Peerless/TESwiki

Already done...
Hehe, just so you guys know, somebody else already started a rather larger and less-wikipedia-clone-like TESwiki over at TESwiki.com ^^/ Peerless 12:47, 17 March 2006 (CST)


 * If by "large", you mean "11 more articles than us" and by "less-wikipedia-clone-like" you mean "hard to navigate", then you are totally right. Gravewit 05:13, 14 March 2006 (CST)


 * It is just as Wiki-clone as this one, just another skin. Also, there are almost no pictures and still the loading times of the site are longer than this one. -- Mercurius0 22:23, 13 March 2006 (GMT+1)


 * Yeah, I think the "already done" post needs to be going over there, not here. -- 05:31, 14 March 2006 (CST)


 * The content is exactly the same as what is here, with some of the articles that others and myself have written for here, so that site is definitely a copy over. --TheSpectator 06:23, 14 March 2006 (CST)


 * Oh really? Are they copying/pasting stuff without giving credit? They can't do that. Gravewit 00:37, 15 March 2006 (CST)


 * At-nc-sa. yes we could. However, this argument is now over. See the newest post at the top. Peerless 12:48, 17 March 2006 (CST)


 * Eh. We aren't planning to be the only Oblivion wiki. Just the best. Good luck beating us. 10:26, 14 March 2006 (CST)


 * Sorry, just came back. Well, stabber - that didn't sound conceited AT. All. Anyway, I am all for wikis, and unlike you (obviously) I understand the spirit of the wiki. Co-operation instead of compitetion... anyway - defaulting to you. I recently posted in all my posts that our wiki was moved to here. I wish you, and all of the oblivion community, luck in all your envdeavors. Have a nice day! Peerless 13:36, 16 March 2006 (CST)}}

We're no wikipedia clone.. we're a guildwiki clone, duh :p :p 23:21, 21 March 2006 (CST)

Setting the record straight on teswiki
I'm a little ashamed at what i'm seeing from my fellow gamers. I don't know what's causing it and maybe i'm a little guilty myself. I see people acting as if creating the best wiki is a competition. The purpose of wikis is to share information, of course, which is why anyone can edit. To say that you will have the "best wiki" is to defeat the purpose of wikis as a whole, which is to provide the best possible information to users for their own benefit. No one here gets credit. This is everyone's project. THAT is why a wiki is.

I see people saying that you guys are "competing" with TESwiki, and well, that just doesn't make any sense to me. If you're really competing, you're doing things for all the wrong purpose.

A few corrections: TESwiki is NOT a copy of this site, the only copy is the skill pages, and the skill pages were mostly, if not completely, copied from other sites. So being against copying the skill pages is hypocritical at best. The rest of the site is, well, original.

Peerless sent me an IM asking me what we should do with TESwiki, since OblivioWiki was looking just as good and growing stronger. He presented me with options and I agreed that we should get the good content from TESwiki, put it on OblivioWiki, and then redirect teswiki to here.

Well, the reception we got here was just rude. And now neither of us are sure that it's the best option. I'd like to hear your opinions on this, guys. What would you like to happen? -- Jeremymia, 68.212.184.173 13:58, 17 March 2006 (CST) (sorry for not registering)


 * Maybe your reception was rude because your buddy came here acting the way he did. You should check your buddy's post, that was for some reason deleted, to remind you that he came here and called our Wiki rather small and wikipedia-clone-like.  I'm also puzzled to see all his posts suddenly removed, by himself (see history).  Ashamed of your actions?  If you and your partner understand the "spirit of wikis" so much, keep to your own, unless you had something about Oblivion to say here. --Wes R 00:31, 18 March 2006 (CST)


 * First of all, I understand what a wiki, does, and how it works (mostly, minus the technical aspect). But since when is it wrong to strive to be the best, most complete Oblivion wiki? Or how about more generally, the best, most complete Oblivion fansite?


 * Second, as Wes stated earlier, it's not appropriate to add talk, then delete all of that, plus delete all the older Talk of "Already Done...", as done by Peerless here). New Talk should simply be added at the end and previous Talk should remain.


 * Third, I can give you several links to your site, compared to our site, which have exact copies of what was here. Skills aren't a problem since that's probably what'll be in-game (although that's a nice little table you have at and looks quite a lot like ours). Although most of those pages here have now been expanded, and that originally they had little content, the fact that pages were simply copied over (mostly verbatim) without mention still remains. Some examples include:
 * Our "mount" of 14:09, March 5, 2006 and your "mount" of 19:32, March 5, 2006.
 * Our "Magicka" as of 13:37, March 5, 2006 vs. your "Magicka" as of 19:27, March 5, 2006
 * Compare the Health, Fatigue, Encumbrance, Storyline (older) pages as well.
 * The wording of the Birthsign pages. Even though the actual definition of each Birthsign is the same as those at the Elder Scrolls main site, the exact wording we used to describe them is the same as described on your site.
 * A few others I don't have the time to link.
 * Notice how on many on those pages, your editing comes hours after our editing of those articles.


 * In addition, some of the pages at your site, such as those of Nord and other races, Daedric Princes, and Tamriel, are also complete copies from the original Wikipedia.


 * Lastly, Peerless had mentioned (before the "Already Done…" section was deleted, that "somebody else already started a rather larger and less-wikipedia-clone-like TESwiki over at TESwiki.com ^^/." By "already started," do you mean that it ‘started over a week later’ than when this site did?


 * You are certainly allowed to have your own Oblivion wiki, but it'd be nice if you wrote your own information. And if you want, feel free to contribute information here.
 * --TheSpectator 01:00, 18 March 2006 (CST)


 * I don't watch what Peerless does. But he's told me that you guys stole the format of our skill page.


 * He deleted the talk thing because he was angry, and I understand why. Regardless, his reaction was just incorrect. But, yeah. I don't have control over that.


 * I have no actions to be ashamed of here. If Peerless has been stealing, fine. That's really inconsequential, isn't it, given the topic at hand?


 * But given your response, I don't see it happening. I don't really care about the wiki, but Peerless does. And with this sort of response, you're only hurting your own wiki by stealing anywhere from 5% to 50% of your own potential users. After all, guild-wars-players-who-also-play-Oblivion-and-love-Wikis isn't the biggest group.


 * And by the way, people - those of you interested in this for glory's sake (as some of you seem to be) would be better off writing a walkthrough and submitting it to gamefaqs. Seriously, I still get an IM a week asking for help about Bloodmoon.


 * The issue is only if your wiki should absorb ours. Everything else has no place in this discussion, in my opinion. Jeremymia, 68.212.184.173 12:06, 18 March 2006 (CST)


 * I'm out of this conversation - however, to defend the other guy posting, I deleted the above conversations, because I rescinded my offer. Peerless 12:33, 18 March 2006 (CST)


 * So yes, true about the at-nc-sa. Okay, back to the discussion: If many of the articles at TESwiki are similar to those of here (esp. those verbatim), then what is the point of having two Oblivion wiki sites? Which goes into the whole absorption thing. I guess it's your call. --TheSpectator 14:24, 18 March 2006 (CST)

I am opposed to any form of merging of Oblivion Wiki with TESWiki, as denizens of TESWiki have proven that we cannot assume good faith about them. Let them take whatever content from us as long as CC restrictions are honored. Other than that, we are wasting valuable time bickering. Let us go our separate ways. 20:41, 18 March 2006 (CST)

The competitive nature has been here for as long as I have known OblivioWiki. In fact, the main page says "We aim to be the #1 resource for your continuing adventures in Tamriel." Does this not mean that we want to beat the other wikis and not necessarily be the best wiki we can be? Think about it. -- Panda 19:54, 19 March 2006 (CST)

Y 4 do U H8?
I, for one, think there's cause for a time-out here. Fighting over something that should be a collaborative effort? Come on, everyone, we can do better than that. My opinion is that any offer that will help improve this wiki and our level of knowledge about Oblivion is a good one. The spirit of a wiki is to work together, and to build a whole from bits and pieces; not to measure e-peens or argue about who stole what content. Please, if someone wants to copy every word from a wiki: let them ( this is Not My Wiki(tm). void where prohibited. ).

It may not be immediately obvious, but as a function of how a wiki works, it is never a finished product, never a stagnant mass. Whatever is copied will quickly devaluate and become stale when not maintained by a zealous user base. Whatever is copied can never be as valuable as the whole. Moreover, why all the angst and harsh words? I really don't understand why it shouldn't be possibly for those -- all -- of us who wish to create a vortex of knowledge about Oblivion, to do so together. A wiki is really not a place for glory hounds, nor jealous guardians of their work. Every day, articles are butchered, re-written, molded, shredded and reworked, by as many people as there are users. That is the magic of wiki, and that is why one simply cannot attach feelings ownership to anything contributed, be it large or small. Rather, one can take comfort in knowing that every little addition helps bring together the whole, for everyone; from everyone.

A wiki is nothing without contributors. I see no reason to turn any away. And I see no reason not to share any and all information with as many others as possible. The marvel of information is that even when you give it all away, you still have just as much as you did before. And if you get even the slightest bit in return you did not have before, then both parties are richer for it.

So let us welcome the people from TESwiki. Let us work together to create, rather than fight. And if they should decide to go ahead with the TESwiki project: good! Let us still work with them. Let us not build ivory towers, but share information, be inspired by each other, and all benefit! -- 12:43, 20 March 2006 (CST)


 * These TESwiki guys are scaring me now. They want in so bad, maybe the are trying to poison us, heh.  In my opinion, you and your friends ought to stick with TESwiki, and stop posting about the mess Peerless started.  Everybody here has forgotten about it, with the exception of you TESwiki guys.  As stated by somebody else up the page a bit, 'let us go our seperate ways'.  I may kill myself if I hear another hippy start talking about "the spirit of the wiki".  Also Bishop, could i get a link to the part where we used "angst and harsh words".  Perhaps you have no frame of reference for this arguement, seeing as you showed up after most of Peerless' actions took place.  --Wes R 02:45, 21 March 2006 (CST)


 * Calm down, Wes. Bishop's one of us. 05:44, 21 March 2006 (CST)