The Elder Scrolls Wiki:Moot/Log October 2018

Oh no Time to leave wiki tthen put the guidance on the template's page Is it about Stub/Incomplete confusion? Except for quest characters. They have a lot of locations which are difficult to be listed in the article, making it meaningless 80-95% of the article = Stub 30-79% = Incomplete ? 1) Expand upon the "Identifying a stub" section of TES:Stub to include more information about when various types of articles are classified as stubs or not, giving broad directives rather than granular instructions, and referencing explanatory blogs where appropriate 2) Add a section on the same project page detailing when to use the various "something is missing from this page" templates, including, , , etc. Their placement in the location is written next to them Not that many editors that can contribute in that field
 * 20:28:43: Atvelonis: I forgot that there was a moot so we're starting late
 * 20:28:49: Atvelonis: We need more staff
 * 20:28:58: Atvelonis: Ok. Moot's starting now
 * 20:28:58: Nekyn Alb: Nono, Atvel, you were testing us
 * 20:29:01: Rozty: i'm so sleepy i don't think i can stay for long
 * 20:29:14: Rozty: well, i forgot too this time so eh
 * 20:29:15: DaBarkspawn: Would you settle for a Staff of Eight Pieces?
 * 20:29:18: Atvelonis: Otto was signed up first, but he's not here right now
 * 20:29:30: Rozty: how many topics do we have
 * 20:29:31: Atvelonis: The only other person signed up is DaBarkspawn afaik
 * 20:29:33: Nekyn Alb: 3
 * 20:29:36: Rozty: nice
 * 20:29:41: Atvelonis: So if you'd like to get started with your topic, go ahead
 * 20:29:44: Rozty: make it 5 minutes each pls
 * 20:29:47: Nekyn Alb: will only take six hours
 * 20:29:49: DaBarkspawn: Sure
 * 20:29:51: KINMUNE: Hello there, TinyClayMan!
 * 20:29:54: Atvelonis: You can take as long as you like
 * 20:29:55: Atvelonis: Hi
 * 20:30:02: Rozty: no tiny topics, no hour long decisions
 * 20:30:09: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: plz don't take 3 hours though
 * 20:30:11: Stygies VIII: 6 hour topics, 12 hour votings
 * 20:30:14: DaBarkspawn: First one: I think there should be some guidance on the stub page as to when to remove a stub
 * 20:30:23: Nekyn Alb: Did you hear, Tiny, you aren't allowed to bring any topics
 * 20:30:31: TinyClayMan: Ohayou
 * 20:30:31: Rozty: wait, isn't it otto first
 * 20:30:37: RhodiumOdi: Not here
 * 20:30:38: Aramithius: Yes, but he isn't here
 * 20:30:40: Rozty: *ah, no otto isn't here*
 * 20:30:40: DaBarkspawn: In particular, when editing Arena pages, there's just a point where there isn't going to be any more information available
 * 20:30:51: DaBarkspawn: But it is still less than full by modern game standards
 * 20:30:59: DaBarkspawn: 
 * 20:31:04: TinyClayMan: >you aren't allowed to bring any topics
 * 20:31:15: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: if it contains all the info there is, it's not a stub
 * 20:31:32: DaBarkspawn: Does anyone object to my adding that to the page?
 * 20:31:34: Stygies VIII: >if it contains all the info there is, it's not a stub
 * 20:31:43: Stygies VIII: I vote yis
 * 20:31:47: Stygies VIII: if I can
 * 20:31:48: Atvelonis: Well
 * 20:31:48: DaBarkspawn: (+)
 * 20:31:49: Aramithius: I think that almost needs to be in the hands of whoever's doing the editing. I they legitimately think that they have all the info there, then they can remove it. But exactly when thery reach that point is the tricky part
 * 20:31:51: Rozty: wait add what
 * 20:31:52: Atvelonis: waaaaaait
 * 20:31:54: Stygies VIII: well wait
 * 20:32:05: DaBarkspawn: /me waits
 * 20:32:06: Rozty: we were talking about stub templates right?
 * 20:32:08: Atvelonis: I think technically the moot leader is supposed to initiate voting :P
 * 20:32:12: DaBarkspawn: kk
 * 20:32:14: Atvelonis: We are in the discussion phase right now
 * 20:32:15: Atvelonis: So
 * 20:32:30: Atvelonis: I think it's not really clear, you're right
 * 20:32:34: TinyClayMan: How is it different from the way it was before?
 * 20:32:41: Rozty: we could use comments for that
 * 20:32:45: DaBarkspawn: right
 * 20:32:47: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: i think i can agree that there needs to be clear guidelines on this
 * 20:32:54: RhodiumOdi: ^
 * 20:32:58: DaBarkspawn: I'm referring to https://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/The_Elder_Scrolls_Wiki:Stub not the template
 * 20:33:10: Nekyn Alb: Isn't stub only for pages with really few infos?
 * 20:33:15: Atvelonis: I think we are tend to overuse stubs a bit
 * 20:33:18: Rozty: man i really need sleep
 * 20:33:19: Atvelonis: But only somewhat
 * 20:33:25: Nekyn Alb: So there could be stuff missing but it's not a stub?
 * 20:33:33: DaBarkspawn: The problem is that "really few" is relative to the game
 * 20:33:35: TinyClayMan: Ah
 * 20:33:41: KINMUNE: Hello there, Starkiller131!
 * 20:33:45: Rozty: so the "Identifying a stub" bit is not descriptive enough?
 * 20:33:54: Atvelonis: wait
 * 20:33:56: Atvelonis: one second
 * 20:33:57: RhodiumOdi: o/
 * 20:33:57: Nekyn Alb: Hey
 * 20:34:01: TinyClayMan: o/
 * 20:34:12: Atvelonis: https://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog%3ABronkiin/De-Stubbing_ESO
 * 20:34:20: Atvelonis: @Dab: so something like this?
 * 20:34:25: Atvelonis: But in the project namespace
 * 20:34:30: Atvelonis: And covering more things
 * 20:34:41: Amulet of Kings: I hope that you read about the time change for the moot and arrived on time
 * 20:34:50: Nekyn Alb: o/
 * 20:34:53: Atvelonis: ayyy
 * 20:34:54: Nekyn Alb: lol
 * 20:34:57: DaBarkspawn: @Atv: yes, exactly
 * 20:35:00: Stygies VIII: imo the guidelines should not be too specific
 * 20:35:02: Rozty: i mean, if the problem is for when a stub should be removed, shouldn't the info be readily available on the page in question
 * 20:35:03: DaBarkspawn: I don
 * 20:35:08: KINMUNE: Hello there, Rodaspi!
 * 20:35:09: DaBarkspawn: 't see the ESO stuff
 * 20:35:26: DaBarkspawn: so, yes in the project space
 * 20:35:32: DaBarkspawn: *namespace
 * 20:35:33: Rozty: depending on the case, it would change
 * 20:35:42: Atvelonis: I agree with Stygies that we shouldn't overcomplicate it
 * 20:35:50: Rozty: no, not the project space, the page that is categorised as a stub
 * 20:36:02: Atvelonis: For many article types you can't really lay out specific guidelines
 * 20:36:12: Atvelonis: We have that blog for ESO because ESO characters are SUPER predictable
 * 20:36:37: Atvelonis: I guess we could add links to explanatory blogs like that. I think there are a few others floating around
 * 20:36:55: Rozty: there are?
 * 20:36:56: Atvelonis: And I could make a subsection elaborating on the general ideas behind stubhood (?) a bit more
 * 20:36:57: Atvelonis: idk
 * 20:36:58: DaBarkspawn: The case that worries me is what I said above: when there isn't enough information for a fully fleshed page and likely never will be
 * 20:37:05: Atvelonis: I think Carlo may have written some
 * 20:37:06: Stygies VIII: if there are not
 * 20:37:07: Stygies VIII: write one
 * 20:37:08: DaBarkspawn: Thank you, Atvelonis
 * 20:37:09: Stygies VIII: simple
 * 20:37:28: TinyClayMan: >SUPER predictable
 * 20:37:42: Rozty: if there is not enough info for a full page, then it's either supposed to be deleted or is not actually a stub
 * 20:38:03: Atvelonis: I think we should be careful not to give editors some leeway in determining what counts as a stub
 * 20:38:14: DaBarkspawn: Right
 * 20:38:15: Atvelonis: i.e. a set of bullet points saying "these things make a stub" would be a little too stringent
 * 20:38:29: Atvelonis: But a set of ideas about what a "complete" article embodies would be more fitting
 * 20:38:29: Aramithius: Do we need a little nod on the tag itself, then?
 * 20:38:39: DaBarkspawn: I'm just trying to avoid conflicts between editors over what constitutes a stub
 * 20:38:44: DaBarkspawn: works for me
 * 20:38:45: Atvelonis: hmm
 * 20:38:48: Aramithius: Becuse people aren't likely to refer back to the template all the time
 * 20:39:00: Atvelonis: Well in terms of editor "conflicts" I would say that those are actually important
 * 20:39:00: Rozty: that's true
 * 20:39:07: Stygies VIII: true
 * 20:39:08: TinyClayMan: Isn't it like
 * 20:39:08: Atvelonis: Consensus-building is how decisions are made here
 * 20:39:24: Atvelonis: @TinyClayMan: other way around
 * 20:39:27: Atvelonis: Incomplete is like
 * 20:39:28: Atvelonis: super-stub
 * 20:39:29: TinyClayMan: What
 * 20:39:38: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: i thought the moot and voting are how decisions are made
 * 20:39:48: Atvelonis: We build a consensus and then vote on it
 * 20:39:49: Rozty: for cases of whether something is a stub wouldn't it be pretty easy to come to a decision anyway?
 * 20:39:52: Atvelonis: (that's what this discussion is)
 * 20:39:52: DaBarkspawn: Moot voting is a kind of consensus
 * 20:39:53: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: true
 * 20:39:58: Atvelonis: @TCM: may be misreading your comment
 * 20:39:59: TinyClayMan: *6100 edits and now I know the difference between a Stub and an Incomplete article*
 * 20:40:06: DaBarkspawn: lol
 * 20:40:33: Atvelonis: I think you can't really apply percentages to it
 * 20:40:44: Atvelonis: But a stub is an overarching template for an article which is missing a decent amount of info
 * 20:40:57: Atvelonis: A page which is missing a very small bit of info is not necessarily a stub
 * 20:41:03: Atvelonis: like one quote or something
 * 20:41:14: Atvelonis: We can use for that
 * 20:41:27: DaBarkspawn: I can accept that as a guideline.
 * 20:41:28: Atvelonis: We use when we find a stub article that is pretty much uselesss
 * 20:41:37: Atvelonis: Like, just an infobox, lead, and blank section headers
 * 20:41:42: Atvelonis: i.e. many ESO quest pages, haha
 * 20:41:44: Atvelonis: My fault :P
 * 20:41:52: Atvelonis: e.g. rather
 * 20:41:56: Atvelonis: But yes that's the idea
 * 20:42:01: TinyClayMan: https://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Beddi_Alielle has no dialogue/conversations/dialogue but has everything else. Is it a stub or an incomplete article?
 * 20:42:07: TinyClayMan: Ah
 * 20:42:12: DaBarkspawn: /me looks up, looks at his watch, whistles and walks off nonchalantly
 * 20:42:14: Atvelonis: Stub
 * 20:42:16: Rozty: tbh stating the reason for why a page is a stub might be helpful for others
 * 20:42:23: Atvelonis: She would only be incomplete if she had like
 * 20:42:25: Atvelonis: Almost nothing
 * 20:42:54: DaBarkspawn: Agree, Rozty
 * 20:43:48: Atvelonis: So I guess I should add something about how to use vs.  vs.  on that page too
 * 20:43:57: DaBarkspawn: Agree
 * 20:44:16: Rozty: i guess, i had the right idea so i thought it was from those pages but i guess not
 * 20:44:36: Atvelonis: You can get a sense for how it's used by making thousands of edits
 * 20:44:40: Atvelonis: Without reading policy
 * 20:44:47: Atvelonis: But having it codified somewhere would really help
 * 20:44:54: DaBarkspawn: (+)
 * 20:45:00: Aramithius: No voting yet
 * 20:45:15: DaBarkspawn: I'm just +1'ing what Atv said
 * 20:45:20: Aramithius: Ah, right
 * 20:45:40: Nekyn Alb: (=)
 * 20:45:46: Atvelonis: Alright
 * 20:46:00: Rozty: so we voting?
 * 20:46:05: Atvelonis: Are we all on the same page here? Any other questions?
 * 20:46:32: Aramithius: What's the formal proposal, then? To add something to the template to encourage users to consider how much info there actually is on a topic before adding/removing the stub template?
 * 20:46:42: Rozty: i guess not? we haven't drifted from the first topic right?
 * 20:47:02: DaBarkspawn: I think the proposal is Atv's comment at 1:43
 * 20:47:13: Rozty: wouldn't that make it the same as the template though
 * 20:47:30: Atvelonis: Attention is used when there is something wrong with the article that needs to be explained
 * 20:47:33: Nekyn Alb: *22:43
 * 20:47:48: DaBarkspawn: sure
 * 20:47:49: Rozty: *23:43
 * 20:47:56: Atvelonis: I'll reiterate
 * 20:47:58: Nekyn Alb: *10:43
 * 20:47:59: Atvelonis: the proposal
 * 20:48:01: Atvelonis: one second
 * 20:48:11: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: *15:43 somewhere in the world
 * 20:48:17: Nekyn Alb: (x)
 * 20:48:24: Rozty: (x)
 * 20:48:24: DaBarkspawn: XD
 * 20:48:49: Rozty: that timezone isn't real
 * 20:48:56: KINMUNE: Hello there, Blademaster Jauffre!
 * 20:49:01: Atvelonis: o/
 * 20:49:05: Blademaster Jauffre: Hello
 * 20:49:10: DaBarkspawn: hi
 * 20:49:18: Nekyn Alb: Timezones aren't real get woke sheeple
 * 20:49:21: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: it's a whole number of hours away from the other timezones. all those timezones are real.
 * 20:49:21: Nekyn Alb: Hi
 * 20:49:32: Rozty: so while atvel reiterates, what was otto's proposal about
 * 20:50:03: DaBarkspawn: Walkthroughs for locations outside of quest walkthroughs
 * 20:50:30: Rozty: ah right, remember there was some confusion about that a while before
 * 20:50:34: DaBarkspawn: Change Style and Formatting to allow for locations to have a special walkthrough on them that does not focus on the quest, but on items, enemies, and other important factors
 * 20:50:59: Blademaster Jauffre: Heard about that, iffy on it
 * 20:51:04: DreamSoulshine: For what game?
 * 20:51:09: Rozty: eso mostly
 * 20:51:11: DaBarkspawn: Was there a specific motivating example?
 * 20:51:13: TinyClayMan: For ESO it would be only about Bosss
 * 20:51:16: Rozty: because of trials and stuff
 * 20:51:23: TinyClayMan: Ah, trials
 * 20:51:28: Atvelonis: The finalized proposal is:
 * 20:51:32: DaBarkspawn: /me has no opinion on ESO stuff
 * 20:51:32: Atvelonis: (+)
 * 20:51:33: Atvelonis: Vote
 * 20:51:34: DreamSoulshine: I know that all Skyrim game locations have "notable items".
 * 20:51:41: Atvelonis: (+) to vote
 * 20:51:46: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: (+)
 * 20:51:49: Aramithius: (+)
 * 20:51:50: TinyClayMan: (+)
 * 20:51:52: DaBarkspawn: (+)
 * 20:51:53: Nekyn Alb: (+)
 * 20:51:54: Amulet of Kings: (=)
 * 20:51:57: RhodiumOdi: (=)
 * 20:52:03: Atvelonis: 5-2-0
 * 20:52:09: Rozty: (+)
 * 20:52:12: DreamSoulshine: (+_
 * 20:52:16: DreamSoulshine: fk
 * 20:52:18: Atvelonis: 6-2-0
 * 20:52:22: TinyClayMan: On notable items:
 * 20:52:23: DreamSoulshine: (+)
 * 20:52:26: Atvelonis: 7-2-0
 * 20:52:31: Atvelonis: hold off one second
 * 20:52:35: Atvelonis: We can do Otto's topic if he shows up
 * 20:52:36: DreamSoulshine: yeah, that's right
 * 20:52:37: Nekyn Alb: (oWo)
 * 20:52:46: TinyClayMan: (OvO)
 * 20:52:48: TinyClayMan: owl
 * 20:52:49: Blademaster Jauffre: (+)
 * 20:53:10: Rozty: (if otto doesn't show up can we still discuss it because i think we really need to)
 * 20:53:16: Nekyn Alb: (vEvO)
 * 20:53:19: Atvelonis: 8-2-0
 * 20:53:28: Atvelonis: It's not really a good idea to present for someone else
 * 20:53:33: Atvelonis: Especially without their approval
 * 20:53:38: DaBarkspawn: +1
 * 20:53:53: Atvelonis: We've done it before and people usually end up getting confused because they might not know all the subtleties of what the OP intended
 * 20:54:02: Rozty: guess not, haven't done any trials so might get messy, but we were also discussing about it on discord
 * 20:54:07: TinyClayMan: Can we ping him somewhere?
 * 20:54:07: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: but if it's a matter that needs to be addressed, it's better to discuss it immediately
 * 20:54:17: Rozty: *discord*
 * 20:54:20: Atvelonis: I pinged staff on Slack and verified members on Discord
 * 20:54:22: Rozty: and slack
 * 20:54:24: Atvelonis: If he's available he'll show up
 * 20:54:29: Nekyn Alb: Lemme quickly replace Otto's name
 * 20:54:34: Atvelonis: I think it is not super pertinent
 * 20:54:42: TinyClayMan: > if it's a matter that needs to be addressed
 * 20:54:52: DaBarkspawn: Also, I don't see the urgency of that item that it can't wait a month
 * 20:54:57: TinyClayMan: Can wait for a proper presentation
 * 20:55:16: Atvelonis: Any other votes?
 * 20:55:36: Rozty: *but until then i have to see people adding walktrhough sections in locations and not know what to do*
 * 20:55:37: Atvelonis: Pelinal, Stygies?
 * 20:55:38: Atvelonis: KINMUNE?
 * 20:55:44: Atvelonis: KINMUNE, did you vote?
 * 20:55:44: KINMUNE: No.
 * 20:55:49: Atvelonis: at least she's honest
 * 20:55:52: DaBarkspawn: lol
 * 20:56:04: Rozty: smh KINMUNE, why are you even here?
 * 20:56:05: Amulet of Kings: Didn't know it was a she
 * 20:56:22: DaBarkspawn: I thought Kimmune identified as an Attack Helicopter
 * 20:56:24: Atvelonis: Why, KINMUNE is our very own Queen Ayrenn
 * 20:56:25: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: KINMUNE, don't come to the moot if you don't intend to participate?
 * 20:56:27: KINMUNE: Ask SuperSajuuk, he probably knows.
 * 20:56:36: Rozty: KINMUNE only answers if her name is first in a sentence, good to know
 * 20:56:52: Nekyn Alb: and with a comma afterwards and a question mark at the end
 * 20:56:55: DaBarkspawn: first word + comma
 * 20:57:02: Nekyn Alb: or /me hugs KINMUNE
 * 20:57:08: DaBarkspawn: awww
 * 20:57:10: Rozty: yeah but her name also needs to be *first*
 * 20:57:14: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: /me punches KINMUNE
 * 20:57:14: KINMUNE: Yol Toor Shul!
 * 20:57:18: Nekyn Alb: and that
 * 20:57:22: Rozty: translate
 * 20:57:29: Rozty: don't speak lizard
 * 20:57:30: Nekyn Alb: Fire Breath
 * 20:57:34: DaBarkspawn: right
 * 20:57:39: Aramithius: So... is that it? No more moot topics?
 * 20:57:45: DaBarkspawn: I have a second one
 * 20:57:46: Rozty: wasn't there one more
 * 20:57:47: Nekyn Alb: Dab Guy had one more
 * 20:57:48: Rozty: oh
 * 20:57:53: Atvelonis: Go ahead
 * 20:57:59: Atvelonis: Previous one passes 8-2-0
 * 20:58:11: DaBarkspawn: If you go to https://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/File:Heldorn_Mount_watchtowers.png you will see the licensing appear twice.
 * 20:58:26: DreamSoulshine: really
 * 20:58:39: Rozty: ok removed it
 * 20:58:39: DaBarkspawn: This is because it uses in info and the drop down does it too
 * 20:58:39: Blademaster Jauffre: That means it's double as legit
 * 20:58:42: DaBarkspawn: ha
 * 20:59:02: DreamSoulshine: It really could have been fixed without needing to bring it to the moot.
 * 20:59:04: DaBarkspawn: I'm suggesting we remove licensing from the template because it is redundant to the drop down
 * 20:59:04: Atvelonis: fixed
 * 20:59:11: DaBarkspawn: cool
 * 20:59:13: DaBarkspawn: I'm done
 * 20:59:17: Atvelonis: oh I didn't mean that
 * 20:59:20: Atvelonis: I fixed how it's supposed to appear
 * 20:59:22: Rozty: *ah wait forgot the nice licensee sentence*
 * 20:59:25: Atvelonis: https://elderscrolls.wikia.com/?diff=2749541
 * 20:59:30: Rozty: licesning
 * 20:59:49: Atvelonis: The system is a little bit confusing but everything is packaged together intentionally
 * 21:00:01: Atvelonis: https://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Category%3AImage_Licensing_Templates
 * 21:00:01: Stygies VIII: omg
 * 21:00:07: Stygies VIII: I forgot there was the moot literally
 * 21:00:13: Stygies VIII: I'm back ;_;
 * 21:00:14: Rozty: *can i also change the w to a capital letter because it is bothering me
 * 21:00:20: Rozty: welcome bakv
 * 21:00:22: Rozty: back
 * 21:00:30: Rozty: i give up on typoing properly
 * 21:00:32: Stygies VIII: what is going on now
 * 21:00:37: Rozty: idk
 * 21:00:40: Stygies VIII: ok
 * 21:00:46: Atvelonis: So the idea is that by using a short template or something then you can save space with the licensing
 * 21:00:51: Atvelonis: Space isn't really the important part though
 * 21:00:54: Rozty: we had one topic that passed, abit clarifying stub use
 * 21:00:54: DaBarkspawn: Rotzy: sure later
 * 21:01:03: Atvelonis: It's mostly that if we need to make a change to the licensing, it's waaaaay easier to do it if everything is bundled together
 * 21:01:03: Stygies VIII: good
 * 21:01:07: Atvelonis: For example
 * 21:01:25: DaBarkspawn: I think, then, the advice on the upload page is bad:
 * 21:01:26: DaBarkspawn: "Licensing" is an absolutely non-optional field which must be used to indicate the license, and "GFDL" or "public domain" licenses must not be used for anything copyrighted by Bethesda or an affiliate. Generally, you will want to use or  if it is your own screenshot. This information is very important.
 * 21:01:27: Atvelonis: If we wanted to change Online: Character Images to Online: NPC Images (just an example), we would have to make 1 edit to the template
 * 21:01:38: Atvelonis: Compared to 8000 edits to all the files individually
 * 21:01:45: Atvelonis: Which is possible, and easier through the bot
 * 21:01:48: Atvelonis: But still a pain in the ass
 * 21:01:51: DaBarkspawn: If you put in the license, you get two
 * 21:01:56: Atvelonis: Oh yeah that's wrong
 * 21:02:12: Atvelonis: I have a link to my licensing page somewhere on Special:Upload
 * 21:02:14: Atvelonis: At the bottom
 * 21:02:22: DaBarkspawn: That's how I noticed the problem
 * 21:02:30: DaBarkspawn: how it gets fixed I am agnostic to
 * 21:02:31: Atvelonis: https://i.gyazo.com/b13dc4412fc91c57606f811b3d4cf50d.png
 * 21:02:44: Atvelonis: User:Atvelonis/Licensing
 * 21:02:49: Atvelonis: This page has the pre-filled templates
 * 21:02:56: Atvelonis: So you would just copy+paste that into the summary box and nothing more
 * 21:03:03: Atvelonis: Ignore the licensing dropdown
 * 21:03:10: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: can "agnostic" be used in this way?
 * 21:03:16: DaBarkspawn: Yes
 * 21:03:27: Atvelonis: We can't remove the dropdown as far as I'm aware, that's built into the page
 * 21:03:37: Atvelonis: And there are some uses for it in unconventional uploads
 * 21:03:43: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: doesn't the term only refer to not knowing whether god exists?
 * 21:03:47: Atvelonis: off-topic
 * 21:03:48: Atvelonis: shush
 * 21:03:52: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: sorry
 * 21:04:10: Atvelonis: But for 95% of uploads what we can do is use the pre-filled versions of with an image licensing template
 * 21:04:17: Atvelonis: And then it has everything and is super easy to manipulate down the road
 * 21:04:41: Atvelonis: I will get around to changing the text on that page though
 * 21:04:46: Atvelonis: Thanks for bringing it up
 * 21:04:49: DaBarkspawn: That's fine, I'll just ignore the drop down
 * 21:04:50: DaBarkspawn: yw!
 * 21:05:09: Rozty: wait, so what was the topic
 * 21:05:21: Atvelonis: To make that whole thing less contradictoryu
 * 21:05:21: DreamSoulshine: I think it was resolved
 * 21:05:25: Atvelonis: *contradictory
 * 21:05:26: Atvelonis: Hi Dwemer
 * 21:05:28: DaBarkspawn: right
 * 21:05:36: Dwemer35: Hello
 * 21:05:40: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: hi
 * 21:05:42: Amulet of Kings: o/
 * 21:05:54: TinyClayMan: o7
 * 21:06:18: Rozty: what kind of keyboard has the 7 and / next to each other
 * 21:06:22: Amulet of Kings: Mine
 * 21:06:30: Rozty: (thinking)
 * 21:06:37: Nekyn Alb: 7 and / are on the same key for me
 * 21:06:43: Atvelonis: wack
 * 21:06:44: Dwemer35: Me too
 * 21:06:48: TinyClayMan: What if I want to use the text emoji?
 * 21:06:49: Atvelonis: Are there other topics?
 * 21:06:49: Rozty: (thinking) (thinking)
 * 21:07:01: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: / is all the way next to . for me
 * 21:07:14: Rozty: they be joking
 * 21:07:16: TinyClayMan: / is on the same button with . for me
 * 21:07:23: Stygies VIII: / is with ? for me
 * 21:07:27: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: . goes with > for me
 * 21:07:31: Stygies VIII: what the hell are your keyboards
 * 21:07:35: Nekyn Alb: . is right of, which is right of M
 * 21:07:35: TinyClayMan: ? / ., a single button
 * 21:07:36: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: / is on ? for me too
 * 21:07:40: Rozty: unless germans like their keyboards all weird and shit
 * 21:07:45: Amulet of Kings: I have a key exclusively for ç, which I never use
 * 21:08:00: Rozty: isn't that a french thing
 * 21:08:04: Nekyn Alb: We use qwertz because we're zool
 * 21:08:13: Stygies VIII: ąężźóśłć
 * 21:08:18: Atvelonis: So I take it there is nothing else to discuss?
 * 21:08:20: Atvelonis: Moot-wise
 * 21:08:22: Stygies VIII: no
 * 21:08:22: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: spanish uses ç?
 * 21:08:23: Amulet of Kings: And I have the super useful ¡¿ too
 * 21:08:23: Atvelonis: If Otto isn't going to be here
 * 21:08:27: Rozty: i guess not?
 * 21:08:33: Nekyn Alb: We discuss keyboards now
 * 21:08:35: Stygies VIII: ^
 * 21:08:37: Nekyn Alb: BOOT
 * 21:08:38: Atvelonis: Ok
 * 21:08:40: Atvelonis: I have something quick
 * 21:08:45: Rozty: ah
 * 21:08:53: TinyClayMan: Ah, make it 2-hour long
 * 21:08:53: DaBarkspawn: My keyboard: http://old.lescasse.com/images/AplKeyboard.png
 * 21:08:56: Amulet of Kings: @Ashley, it hasn't but Spanish keyboards have that key for an unknown reason
 * 21:08:57: Rozty: that feels like a stab in the back
 * 21:09:22: Atvelonis: https://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:1024325
 * 21:09:35: Stygies VIII: why do you have the Insignia of Death symbol on the keyboard, Bark
 * 21:09:37: Atvelonis: If you have any thoughts on this, say them
 * 21:09:38: Stygies VIII: ok Atv, reading
 * 21:09:43: Atvelonis: I think you already commented
 * 21:09:45: DaBarkspawn: It's for APL
 * 21:09:54: Stygies VIII: ah, it's this one
 * 21:09:55: Atvelonis: I'm going to initiate the voting on the thread this evening
 * 21:09:55: Stygies VIII: I did
 * 21:10:08: Rozty: nice, i'm saved by the fact that i participated
 * 21:10:16: TinyClayMan: I've read it but what was the suggestion about it?
 * 21:10:16: Atvelonis: So if anyone has other thoughts on the topic, please say so, otherwise it will move forward into the voting phase
 * 21:10:25: Atvelonis: (comment on the thread, don't say them here)
 * 21:10:29: Stygies VIII: @rozty we still have to vote
 * 21:10:33: Stygies VIII: kek
 * 21:10:40: TinyClayMan: (almost forgot what was it about)
 * 21:10:41: Rozty: but i don't have to read all that wall
 * 21:10:45: Stygies VIII: nice
 * 21:10:57: Nekyn Alb: Let me read it to you
 * 21:11:03: Nekyn Alb: With German accent
 * 21:11:13: Nekyn Alb: Which I'm fairly sure I can't actually do
 * 21:11:26: Stygies VIII: Are you German?
 * 21:11:26: Rozty: the Circle was about voting on good and comprehensible articles but now it
 * 21:11:30: Nekyn Alb: I am
 * 21:11:33: Stygies VIII: nice
 * 21:11:35: Rozty: it's ded and we need it gone
 * 21:11:37: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: how can you not do a german accent? i'm quite good at doing a dutch accent
 * 21:11:42: Stygies VIII: we live next to eachother
 * 21:11:43: Stygies VIII: almost
 * 21:11:49: TinyClayMan: A replacement would be a public vote?
 * 21:11:56: Rozty: you all are way too high up for me
 * 21:11:57: Nekyn Alb: I live next to every wikian :^)
 * 21:11:59: The Beautiful Princess Ashley: so good in fact that i hate it when people hear my horrible accent
 * 21:12:00: Rozty: and yes
 * 21:12:09: Stygies VIII: I live next to Polish FANDOM headquarters ehehe
 * 21:12:13: Nekyn Alb: I just talk too gud
 * 21:12:18: Atvelonis: Alright
 * 21:12:20: Atvelonis: I declare this moot over