Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-209.7.3.188-20160303204000/@comment-30011802-20161102174634

I have more proof that Ulfric is not bad.

Anyway, an argument that is commonly defended is that Ulfric is power hungry and a savage. To those who say he’s power hungry, you’re right. Congratulations. But is that a bad thing? I assume when people say this, they mean that he is power hungry for the sake of power alone. That is false. He wants power so that he can do what his supporters want him to, which is to save Skyrim from the Empire’s influence and restore Talos worship. Don’t believe me? Does this sound like the words of one who fights for the sake of having power alone?

.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2A_5kBJduIg

.

For those of you who say he’s just acting…come on, really? In his palace with the grand total of one stranger? No.. People also say him killing Torygg is proof of his hunger for power, because his court mage says he was a fan of him, and he agreed with what Ulfric was saying, and Ulfric should have talked to him first. Do you see the contradiction? Torygg’s court wizard says Torygg knew of his agenda, and Ulfric stated them at the last moot to the point to where he spoke just shy of treason. He already spoke in front of him! Speak up and be a man, you’re the High King of Skyrim for Kyne’s sake, Torygg! Torygg, the High King of Skyrim should have said something then if he agreed.

.

And they say he should have asked Torygg one last time before he issued his challenge, but from Ulfric’s perspective this would have been stupid. He’s in the middle of the Imperial seat of power in Skyrim at the mercy of the Emperor’s greatest Skyrim supporter who swore an oath to him, and showed no evidence of agreeing with Ulfric at the moot, and Ulfric is supposed to risk being arrested for treason in the belly of the beast? . A counter argument to this is he just killed the High King, so obviously he didn’t care about that to begin with. This is wrong, because Ulfric challenged him to a legal duel according to Skyrim’s laws and would not have been arrested. A duel is a part of Nord politics, and after a duel is won, if the High King is dead, they have another moot, and pick a new High King. People say it is an outdated law, but Torygg agreed to the duel, so clearly the law is still in place. It was only an issue after the Empire came in and said it was illegal according to Imperial law.

.

So Ulfric went in knowing that he wouldn’t be arrested for challenging the King to a duel. This is a political checkmate. Either Torygg agrees to the duel and he wins, and a moot is held, which Ulfric would have won due to being the winner, since Elisif likely would back down out of fear to him, or Torygg doesn’t accept, and Ulfric has a good chance of winning due to Torygg looking weak. Either way if the Empire did not interfere, Ulfric may very well have been the new High King. . This does not sound like the workings of a savage to me. It sounds like one who knows his people’s politics and knew how to play them well. People may think he’s savage only because of the nature of the Nordic politics, which is outdated compared to non combat loving countries. Ulfric can’t be held accountable for playing the politics. He didn’t make the rules. And as said before, Ulfric did not murder the High King, he fought Torygg in a duel. Whether you think it was dishonorable or what have you is a different issue.

.

Torygg knew that Ulfric had the Thu'um, and accepted the fight anyway. He also knew he was a seasoned warrior, and likely still would have lost the fight. To Nords, a duel to the death even with the thu'um that is revered in their culture is not dishonorable or cowardly. His use of the thu'um simply shows he was the stronger. Whether you believe that or not isn’t the point. The Nords do.

Also:

http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1454121-can-stormcloak-people-explaine-this-to-me/?p=22498185 colonel-(That’s me :) ) one thing u need to add to ir aticky about the courtmage. She goes thru this huge spill abouy how torygg MIGHT have sided with ulfric but ends the conversation stating that torygg would have NEVER sided with ulfric and goes thru the reasons qhy he would never.

For some reason when people bring up the mage, they never bring up that part.

Basicqlly the people who bring her up as the reason Ulfric should have talked, never state that even of he did it wouldnt change toryggs mind according to the very sourse they use and Ulfric would have ended up executed for being a traitor.

Basically using the mage, acually proves that Ulfric really had no choice buy to do the duel. Kinda funny Indeed. Which means Ulfric would have wasted his time talking further, and he made the right call.