User blog:Draevan13/Skyrim Civil War edit discussion

Moved here so as to not clutter the page's Talk Page:

 * Enough time has transpired where cooler heads have prevailed and Jauffre and I have provided our points in the defense of our desired intents. Jauffre wants to make the changes to the contents he listed, I desire the page to remain as it is. So far, those are the only proposed solutions to this page. This page will be unlocked by November 6,2016. If no one speaks out in support of Jauffre's desired changes by then, I will take that as emphatic consent that the page should remain as it is and if he takes the opportunity to reword and delete any of the contested content discussed, I will be in my right to restore it to its previous incarnation.(Sports72Xtrm (talk) 15:00, November 2, 2016 (UTC))
 * Whether we support it or not is irrelvant. The way it'll work is this: if both of you can provide in-game sources for your claims, both sides go up on the page. If only one can, then only that side goes up. If neither can, neither goes up.  DRAEVAN13  15:09, November 2, 2016 (UTC)
 * What of his points about changing the name of the Mede Empire and the trivia part? The trivia part comes from the Ulfric Dossier but wants to reword it which I feel is in a misleading manner and both he and I apparently have a dispute over what the name of the Empire should be.(Sports72Xtrm (talk) 15:17, November 2, 2016 (UTC))
 * Unless we can find an in-game source calling the Skyrim version of the Empire "Fourth Empire" or "Mede Empire", I think we should keep calling it "The Empire" or "Third Empire".
 * As for the trivia bit, I have no problem with either yours or Jauffre's, both are factually accurate. Some way of combining them would work best.  DRAEVAN13  15:25, November 2, 2016 (UTC)
 * Maybe something like this?
 * "The Thalmor Dossier states that Ulfric Stormcloak is considered a "dormant asset", and that "Ulfric's death would have dramatically increased the chance of an Imperial victory and thus harmed [their] overall position in Skyrim."
 * While the Thalmor would rather neither side win and the fight drag on, a Stormcloak victory would be preferable to them over an Imperial victory."  DRAEVAN13  15:33, November 2, 2016 (UTC)
 * :::::::  ""Ulfric's death  at Helgen  would have dramatically increased the chance of an Imperial victory and thus harmed [their] overall position in Skyrim."  At Helgen must be included because it is specified in the Dossier'(Sports72Xtrm (talk))
 * No I reject this line because this is factually untrue as they don't have a preference on which side wins the civil war, just that the civil war keeps going. To imply othewise is misleading which is why I reject his efforts of rewording it in such a way in the first place.(Sports72Xtrm (talk) 15:37, November 2, 2016 (UTC))
 * As I said, they want neither side to win the warand for it to bleed the Empire dry. But if the Empire wins, Skyrim is unified and stronger. If Ulfric wins, the Empire is further divided and weakened. It's not factually inaccurate to say a Stormcloak victory is preferable to them over an Imperial victory.  DRAEVAN13  15:49, November 2, 2016 (UTC)
 * Still a speculation of the Thalmor's motives, it says right there that a complete Stormcloak victory is to be avoided. If the Stormcloacks win, the Thalmor are ousted out of Skyrim losing their agents in enemy territory, and a province no longer hindered by the Empire's Treaty can wage war with impunity while Cyrodiil can deny involvement like they did with Hammerfell. For all intents and purposes, the Thalmor does not technically profit from this since if the Empire disavows Skyrim's actions, they cannot be held responsible. No where is it explicitly said in that Dossier that they desire the Stormcloaks to win the Civil War. What is explicitly said is that a "Stormcloak victory is to be avoided".(Sports72Xtrm (talk))
 * It says " Stormcloak cloak victory is  also  to be avoided".

I also never said the Thalmor want the Stormcloaks to win. Only that, while a stalemate is preferred, an Imperial victory would be worse for them than a Stormcloak one due the Empire being re-unified. It's not speculation since we know from the Dossier the Thalmor's goal is to destabilise the Empire.  DRAEVAN13  16:02, November 2, 2016 (UTC)


 * And I contest that " a Stormcloak victory would be preferable to them over an Imperial victory" is completely misleading and untrue. It is speculative to suggest that the Thalmor desires to destabilize the Empire by having Skyrim gain independence instead of weakening each other by waging war with each other through the civil war. The two are ompletely different notions.(Sports72Xtrm (talk))
 * And I contest that " a Stormcloak victory would be preferable to them over an Imperial victory" is completely misleading and untrue. It is speculative to suggest that the Thalmor desires to destabilize the Empire by having Skyrim gain independence instead of weakening each other by waging war with each other through the civil war. The two are ompletely different notions.(Sports72Xtrm (talk))