Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-176.70.148.40-20140106201915/@comment-25047024-20140108124751

Dovahsebrom wrote:

AngryEnclaveSoldier wrote: Well, mortal believe can form gods in TES.

As far as I understand it, it is like this: All bigger shards (Auriel, etc) and the smaller shards (the Dragons) are (or were) actually one Time God. Mortal believe made that Time God break. Akatosh, Auriel, Alduin, etc, are essentially the same but not THE same, if you understand me. They all developed their own mind and can even hate each other. For example: What happens when Alduin returns to Nirn? His brother/mirror image Akatosh sends a Dragonborn to stop him.

They are all parts of the same thing, but they think differently.

Lorkhan and the Time Gods seems to me like Spacetime in physics. They are bound to each other. We all know of the Lorkhan/Auriel/Trinimac Enatiomorph. Another example of this is Pelinal Whitestrake. He is an avatar of Lorkhan and Akatosh, send back in time to make Akatosh possible. Pelinal is also damn crazy. ''"O Aka, for our shared madness I do this!" Someone apparently also called him a Shezzarine, but was later killed by moths: "It is a solid truth that Morihaus was the son of Kyne, but whether or not Pelinal was indeed the Shezarrine is best left unsaid (for once Plontinu, who favored the short sword, said it, and that night he was smothered by moths).''" Pelinal probably just wanted to say that he's both. Aka and Shezzar. Time and Space...

Time and Space coexist in our Universe and are bound together. If one breaks, the other one breaks too (for example, in a Black Hole). This is also the case with Aka and Lorkhan, with Anu and Padomay, with all the Time Shards and all Space Gods. Aka is the Time God and consists out of all Time Gods that exist, while Lorkhan seems to be rather unique. And this is where I find inconsistency...

"All Tamrielic religions begin the same. Man or Mer, things begin with the dualism of Anu and His Other. These twin forces go by many names: Anu-Padomay, Aniel-Sithis, Ak-El, Satak-Akel, Is-Is Not. Anuiel is the Everlasting Ineffable Light, Sithis is the Corrupting Inexpressible Action."

"Anu encompassed, and encompasses, all things. So that he might know himself he created Anuiel, his soul and the soul of all things. Anuiel, as all souls, was given to self-reflection, and for this he needed to differentiate between his forms, attributes, and intellects. Thus was born Sithis, who was the sum of all the limitations Anuiel would utilize to ponder himself."

"Aspects of the Aurbis then asked for a schedule to follow or procedures whereby they might enjoy themselves a little longer outside of perfect knowledge. So that he might know himself this way, too, Anu created Auriel, the soul of his soul. Auriel bled through the Aurbis as a new force, called time."

-The Monomyth

First Quote: Rules of the universe's duality, Anu-Padomay, Anuiel (Aniel)-Sithis; and so on.

Second Quote: Anu birthed Anuiel, Sithis is obviously the opposite of Anuiel within universal Duality.

Third Quote: Anuiel birthed Auriel

"One idea, however, became jealous and did not want to die; like the stasis, he wanted to last. This was the demon Anui-El, who made friends, and they called themselves the Aedra. They enslaved everything that Sithis had made and created realms of everlasting imperfection. Thus are the Aedra the false gods, that is, illusion."

"So Sithis begat Lorkhan and sent him to destroy the universe. Lorkhan! Unstable mutant!"

-Sithis

First: Anui-El is obviously the opposite to Sithis within Universal Duality

Second: Sithis births Lorkhan, making him the equal/opposite of Auri-El within universal duality

"Auri-El (King of the Aldmer): The Elven Akatosh is Auri-El. Auri-El is the soul of Anui-El, who, in turn, is the soul of Anu the Everything."

- Varieties of Faith in the Empire

Once again claims that Anuiel is the birthed soul of Anu, while Auriel is the birthed soul of Anuiel

"As the process of subcreation continued, both Anu and Padhome awakened. For to see your antithesis is to finally awaken. Each gave birth to their souls, Auriel and Sithis, and these souls regarded the Aurbis each in their own part"

"Anu’s firstborn, for he mostly desired order, was time, anon Akatosh. Padhome’s firstborn went wandering from the start, changing as he went, and wanted no name but was branded with Lorkhan."

-Vehk's Teachings

'''First Quote: states that Anu's soul is Auriel instead of Anuiel, and Padomay's soul is Sithis. This just plain breaks lore, and unbalances universal duality. I am convinced this has to be a typo or something by MK, as this basically claims that Anuiel never existed. Which couldn't be true as MK wrote about him in a post'''

"A single Wheel? More like a Telescope that stretches all the way back to the Eye of the Anui-El, with Padomaics innumerable along its infinite walls."

Second Quote: states that Anu's firstborn was Time, or Akatosh. While Padomay's Firstborn was Lorkhan (into the Aurbis, and this refers to their Aurbical forms, which "should" be Anuiel and Sithis). This also seems to contradict what you're saying as it is stating that Akatosh/Lorkhan were the direct births of "Anuiel" and Sithis, meaning Akatosh is Lorkhan's equal/opposite, implying Akatosh is the Time-God.

We also hear quite often that, Alduin was "birthed" (broken off) from Akatosh, and that he is quite obviously a seperate entity from Akatosh; this is applied also to dragons.

"Yes. Alduin... zeymah. The elder brother. Gifted, grasping and troublesome as is so often the case with firstborn."

"Alduin was once the crown of our father Akatosh's creation"

-Paarthurnax

Yet Auriel is never considered a piece of Akatosh but instead an equal.

"they hated any admission that Akatosh, the Supreme Spirit, was indisputably also Auriel, the Elven High God."

"Newly invented rituals were utilized to disprove this theory, to no avail."

-Where were you when the Dragon Broke?: Long Version

Auriel/Akatosh is also the only Time-God to actually seem to be birthed from duality, the other entitys of the Time-God are just there.

Then their is the fact that Alduin also has an equal/opposite, which would be Shor.

Here is the only two plausible theorys I can conclude...

One:

Lorkhan is not the Space-God, Sithis is; and Anuiel is the Time-God as he birthed "Time" (Auriel).

Two:

'''Auriel/Akatosh is the Time-God and the lesser aspects (Alduin, Alkosh, etc.) are his break offs. Lorkhan remains the Space-God.''' Yeah, I think that Anuiel/Auriel thing is indeed just a typo or a mistake from a writer.

I don't have much time right now, I'll edit this post later and add more to it.

I already stated my theory, which was that the Time Gods and Dragons are shards from the original Time God (let's call him Aka). About the stuff that Paarthurnax says:

Akatosh was created when Alessia merged the nordic Alduin and Altmeri Auriel into one being. Over the time, Akatosh worship seems to have increased extremely. In Daggerfall , we see that the Imperial Pantheon is almost everywhere in High Rock worshipped. The Nords of Skyrim apparently now (in the 4th Era) also worhsip the Imperial Pantheon. The Imperials all worship the Imperial Pantheon.

Believe in TES can shape gods and even make them more powerful(which is one of the reasons that the Thalmor want to stop Talos worship). Akatosh worship is now so big, that Akatosh became the most powerful Time God. Even more powerful than Alduin. This is why Paarthurnax most likely thought of Akatosh being his and Alduins father: He thought that, since Akatosh is the most powerful one, that Alduin (the less powerful one) is his child. It's basicly like this:

IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII = Original Time God (Aka)

(Mortal believe shatters Aka)

IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII (Akatosh)

IIIIIIIIIIII (Alduin)

The other ones might be between them.

By the way, this might also be the reason why Alduins is not absorbed by the LDB. Akatosh (or Aka, the original time god) absorbed his soul. This would mean that the Akatosh shard became more powerful by adding one other shard to him. So:

IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII = Aka

IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII (Akatosh) + IIIIIIIIIIIIII (Alduin) = IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII (Akatosh)

I'll extend this post later.