Board Thread:Off Topic/@comment-6326997-20150104052417

I know this discussion is overdone and I'ma get kicked in the head for starting a VS thread. But I have to share my opinion and ask someone else's opinion.

So  without further ado I present to you

The Elder Scrolls: Dunmeri vs Aldmeri

Reason:

In a lot of threads I look at, I see Dunmer being painted as a race that has to fight all day to survive their homeland, and thus when removed from said fighting they should be better than the tropical paradise natives that don't do much but sit on their arses and complain how the Empire (who doesn't really do much in the way of controlling them) should be dissolved.

This to me is not only wrong, but incredibly illogical.

Case:

Picture this, a creature, stuck on an overly crowded planet where they must fight over the little water that remains on its surface (or below ground for that matter). Said creature is removed and has to fight another creature from a different world where he/she is well watered and fed.

Would the war torn creature just automatically be better than the peaceful one? Absolutely not (and I don't mean just invariably). Health and natural ability are two major things that any fighter has to take into account before beginning a confrontation.

Point

From the feats of these two non-rival civilizations I see only this. The dunmer may have it worse, but they aren't necessarily better because of it. Despite surviving the various natural phenomenon that plagues their homeland, they have actually done very little conquest or expansion of their own. This does not mean they are readily invaded, but during times of war with a force greater than or equal to their own they usually (apart from the Tribunal) did not have much success. The argonians, whom formerly were indentured to the dark elves have now conquered much of Morrowind. And before that the Nords regularly raided their western border.

I'm going to give them points to their battles against the Dwarves, for whatever reason Nearavar was able to lead their forces against the Dwarves who had superior technology and home field advantage, and stalemate them.

Altmer:

The race that perhaps all races have learned from, and from which the "Elder Race of mer is preserved. The altmer are thought to live a leisurely life that would cause one to get fat and die of boredom and inability.  They are magical creatures to be sure, even more magical than the Empire's famous Breton, who primarily gain their fame because of them being the only real mageborn humans in a human dominated society.

When most people think Altmer they may remember seeing a tall, slender, arrogant, yellow man or woman who spoke in eloquence but was either too snobby or too annoying to hang around for extended period of time, and they are not wrong, for most Altmer seen outside of Summerset carries a great deal of nationalism regardless of where they go, within the Empire or Dominion, skilled or unskilled, many Altmer believe in an elven dominated society.

It is easy to forget however, that most altmer seen or contacted with are the outcast or the thalmor. We don't actually get to see how rigid or loose their homeland ways are, and we only hear about it. One thing that should be noted is that the Psyjiic order is perhaps the most powerful Guild of spellcasters the world has ever and will ever see. It is their magic that protects Summerset (or at least it did) and who's to say that it doesn't also control the weather to make it so bright and sunny most days?

Looking at the accomplishments and failures of the Thalmor, I am only really familiar with two major events. The conquest, and subsequent downfall. And the rebirth of the Dominion. In the first case, Tiber Septim led a race of would-be-conquerors but he didn't do it alone. Indeed many had tried to claim the rich spoils of Summerset but were unable to even cross the sea to reach its shores. But Numidium happened, an ancient artifact created by the dwarves and was never used against the dunmer by the Dwemer or Deep Elves. This artifact took some work to even get the thing working, and it is debated to this day as to how Tiber managed to turn the thing on, much less conquer an island nation with it.

Nonetheless it took great effort to take this "weak" race down, which leads me to believe that either there magic is just that strong, or perhaps we do not know as much about the Altmer as we think.

When they rose as the Dominion it took them only a few years to sweek across Tamriel and destroy the remnants of the Empire in the southwestern part of Tamriel. They are more than rivals and their signing of a treaty is almost considered an acceptance of forfeit from the Empire itself, seeing how much it affects the Empire with little known side-effects on the Dominions side.

The ability to change the politics of a world that is already based off of your home culture to me shows that even the Swordsmanship honed by other races (except maybe the Redguard) is just a bi-product of your own skills, and this isn't even mentioning the fact that conjuration is readily able to summon powerful bound weapons which require skill to wield.

Ending Remarks

My point in stating all these things was this: The Dunmer are overrated to me, because of Morrowind and because of the idea that a hard-not-life makes you stronger. In my own personal opinion the dunmer are actually a bit weak, not just politically but literally weak. They have chosen isolation, but infight too much to be an effective offensive force anyways. They take slaves from Argonia, but only on the outskirts for no one dares to enter the Blackmarsh proper, and whereas the Argonians survived the Oblivion crisis, Morrowind was crushed by Molag, and then crushed by Blackmarsh. They never truly defeated the Nords, and the Tribunal and Morrowind as a whole came under the influence of the Empire.

Meanwhile in Summerset, the High Elves had to be conquered by an ancient weapon that was made to be akin to a Dwarven version of a god. Even still the Empire never truly had complete control over Summerset as their influence was relatively small in the day-to-day and even governance of the island(s). I believe when the Empire attacked they were not opposed by the Psyjiics (They may have even been supported by the Order, but I am unsure) and even still, many High Elves went on to hold high office in both the military and government of the Empire itself. This coupled with its ability to completely overwhelm the Empire at the beginning of the Great War, and end the war on their terms just goes to show how universally powerful the Altmer actually are.

It is feats of people, not the accomplishments of one person that decide which race is and isn't better than another, and in my opinion the Altmer are one of the most if not the most powerful and influential race in all of Nirn. Whilst the Dunmer as of late, are relatively weak and more akin to Orcs than anything else (so much for high society).

Jacksper (talk) 05:24, January 4, 2015 (UTC) 