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  • Timeoin
    Timeoin closed this thread because:
    Requested
    11:18, October 27, 2013

    I know, the prologue made it rather hard to go Imperial, but once in the game politics we not so sure.. We cannot blame the Stormcloaks for being a little bit miffed at outsiders or racist towards elves. Skyrim is their ancestral homeland and the Nords having to deal with an outside influence trying to ban the worship of one of their own native sons and greatest heroes for the sake of appeasing another group of foreigners. won't take sides. my previous character sided with the Stormcloaks. Personally, I despise Mede Empire and the crappy White-Gold Concordat. The Empire we knew died with the Remans/Septims,


    Each has their own fault. Stormcloaks are clearly more powerful in terms of Skyrim politics over the Imperials as the Empire has gone to $hit since Oblivion. They are likw the Germanic people who fought the Romans 2000 years ago. The Stormcloaks would make better rulers in terms of a more stable government, but they are extremely provocative. Only Nords would get fair treatment which is not right.  The Thalmor does not want either side to win. The elves want the civil war to continue until both sides are weakened, and then swoop down on both, creating an Ayleid-ish Empire. So the Thalmor are puppeteering both sides.

    The Empire became puppets of the Thalmor which seek to return Tamriel to the days of Ayleid rule when they enslaved Men. Thalmor is strong n my opinion and an Empire that is so weak that they just accept the terms of these devious elves is no Empire I like. If the Empire still had a strong Emperor in place and refused to the Thalmor in Skyrim. And the Imperials tried to execute you in the beginning with no fair trial which is a dick move in my opinion. The end result is still the same douchebag guards who arrest you when there is a bounty.

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    • The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.

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    • I think the Empire is better for Skyrim in the long run, and the Imperials should be the ones angry about Talos, as he was there Emperor. They were able to accept not worshiping him, and so should the Stormcloaks. I think it is a matter of the Stormcloaks needing to stop openly worshiping him so the Leigon can grow in strength to fight the Dominion, and the Stormcloaks can't see that they are playing right into the hands of the Dominon by keeping the Empire's focus away from Alinor.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.

      Yeah, that is why we should stick with Tullius. He is forgiving and tolerant. And that Imperial Officer bitch died at Helgen. I joined the Imperials immediately after visiting Windhelm. The Stormcloaks are a bunch of xenophobic jerks.

      Perhaps the Empire and Hammerfell should make a deal with Mehrunes Dagon, the Daedra could easily butcher the Aldmeri Dominion with their overwhelming forces. The Thalmor trying to mess with time and make Nirn disappear. If they get close to finding a way, that be a worse threat than Dagon.

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    • TheGreenSabre wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.
      Yeah, that is why we should stick with Tullius. He is forgiving and tolerant. And that Imperial Officer bitch died at Helgen. I joined the Imperials immediately after visiting Windhelm. The Stormcloaks are a bunch of xenophobic jerks.

      Perhaps the Empire and Hammerfell should make a deal with Mehrunes Dagon, the Daedra could easily butcher the Aldmeri Dominion with their overwhelming forces. The Thalmor trying to mess with time and make Nirn disappear. If they get close to finding a way, that be a worse threat than Dagon.

      Really? Make a deal with the devil? That would cause mass rioting.

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:
      TheGreenSabre wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.
      Yeah, that is why we should stick with Tullius. He is forgiving and tolerant. And that Imperial Officer bitch died at Helgen. I joined the Imperials immediately after visiting Windhelm. The Stormcloaks are a bunch of xenophobic jerks.

      Perhaps the Empire and Hammerfell should make a deal with Mehrunes Dagon, the Daedra could easily butcher the Aldmeri Dominion with their overwhelming forces. The Thalmor trying to mess with time and make Nirn disappear. If they get close to finding a way, that be a worse threat than Dagon.

      Really? Make a deal with the devil? That would cause mass rioting.

      Daedra are not devils, nor demons.

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    • Here we go again....

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    • Oh I'm sorry, there are so different. Dagon only wanted to invade Tamriel.

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:
      Oh I'm sorry, there are so different. Dagon only wanted to invade Tamriel.

      Hey,stop it.Just because they are viewed as evil and curse-bring by the masses doesn't mean they are inherently evil,as the concept of good and evil is not present on their souls.I could just link that preposterous commentaire to real life beliefs and flame the entire forum,but i'll rather sleep.

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    • Pickleseller
      Pickleseller removed this reply because:
      ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff
      03:17, August 7, 2013
      This reply has been removed
    • Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:

      ,but i'll rather sleep.

      That is something we can all agree with.

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    • Pickleseller wrote: The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.

      Well the stormcloaks were unarmed and their hands were tied so why did you think they ran.

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    • 54.215.41.97 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:

      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.

      Well the stormcloaks were unarmed and their hands were tied so why did you think they ran.

      They were all unbound.

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    • The stormcloaks saw the oppurtunity and tried to escape while the empire was trying to save lives. And also later if you teamed up with Hadvar, the first Stormcloaks he sees, he wants to negotiate but they attack instead. If you team up with Ralof, he ambushes legion soldiers running away. Long live the empire.

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    • Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

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    • What about the dominion. Without the empire, there is nothing stopping the Dominion from invading.

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    • Supersonicman wrote:
      What about the dominion. Without the empire, there is nothing stopping the Dominion from invading.

      Last time I checked there was only one entrance into Skyrim large enough for an army to travel through, so the Aldermi could easily be stopped there. 

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    • Al Wolf2200 wrote:
      Supersonicman wrote:
      What about the dominion. Without the empire, there is nothing stopping the Dominion from invading.
      Last time I checked there was only one entrance into Skyrim large enough for an army to travel through, so the Aldermi could easily be stopped there.

      How so, the army is now stormcloaks and the enemy is the superior Dominion with better armor, better weapons, better magic and larger numbers. 

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    • Supersonicman wrote:
      Al Wolf2200 wrote:
      Supersonicman wrote:
      What about the dominion. Without the empire, there is nothing stopping the Dominion from invading.
      Last time I checked there was only one entrance into Skyrim large enough for an army to travel through, so the Aldermi could easily be stopped there.
      How so, the army is now stormcloaks and the enemy is the superior Dominion with better armor, better weapons, better magic and larger numbers. 

      And a better navy.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Supersonicman wrote:
      Al Wolf2200 wrote:
      Supersonicman wrote:
      What about the dominion. Without the empire, there is nothing stopping the Dominion from invading.
      Last time I checked there was only one entrance into Skyrim large enough for an army to travel through, so the Aldermi could easily be stopped there.
      How so, the army is now stormcloaks and the enemy is the superior Dominion with better armor, better weapons, better magic and larger numbers. 
      And a better navy.

      All they would have to do is take Windhelm by sea, and the disorganized rabble would crumble.

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    • The legion is better for skyrim

      ulfric is a racist, power-hungry mainiac who murdered the high king.

      The thalmor would crush skyrim easily.

      If the entire united empire barely stopped the thalmor, what makes you think that skyrim alone could stop it?

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    • Sevenof13
      Sevenof13 removed this reply because:
      Im new and i cant find the forum posts so im mroe than happy to read newer threads rather than reading old outdated ones. tell him to shut the fuck up already.
      02:18, August 24, 2013
      This reply has been removed
    • I think the Empire won this debate.

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    • I'd agree.

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    • Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I'd agree.

      Recognize my symbol, Caesar?

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    • Neither. The Mede Empire is weak and corrupt and the Stormcloaks are radical nationalists with a pinch of racism. Plus, fighting each other while a common foe is waiting to pounce is really idiotic.

      Or as I like to call it, the "Screw both those factions" faction.

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    • The empire does not want too fight, but it does to protect what is left of itself.

      Losing skyrim would cause economic backlash, and it would lose the legions associated with skyrim.

      The stormcloaks forced there hand.

      And yes, i recognize it.

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I'd agree.
      Recognize my symbol, Caesar?

      House Tullius,right?

      The rest of you people,go to other threads,or even that stupid stormcloakblog post.

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    • I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.

      All they need to do is take windhelm? that is but one city, even though it is the seat of jarl ulfrics power. example: the thalmor took the imperial city, did the stop the empire?

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    • Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      Goldflame33 wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I'd agree.
      Recognize my symbol, Caesar?
      House Tullius,right?
      • facepalm* Wrong game, SAVW
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    • Caeser Augustus wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      All they need to do is take windhelm? that is but one city, even though it is the seat of jarl ulfrics power. example: the thalmor took the imperial city, did the stop the empire?

      Okay, you got me there. But my point still stands: The stormcloaks will be destroyed aganst the Dominion.

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    • I think that the only way the Dominion is a very long war or all of the races of Man coming together.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:

      Goldflame33 wrote:
      TheGreenSabre wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.
      Yeah, that is why we should stick with Tullius. He is forgiving and tolerant. And that Imperial Officer bitch died at Helgen. I joined the Imperials immediately after visiting Windhelm. The Stormcloaks are a bunch of xenophobic jerks.

      Perhaps the Empire and Hammerfell should make a deal with Mehrunes Dagon, the Daedra could easily butcher the Aldmeri Dominion with their overwhelming forces. The Thalmor trying to mess with time and make Nirn disappear. If they get close to finding a way, that be a worse threat than Dagon.

      Really? Make a deal with the devil? That would cause mass rioting.

      Daedra are not devils, nor demons.

      Correct, Daedra are not demons. They be more like the Hindu Devas or Asura since they occupy an alternate realm and have a deadly magical mastery. Daedra are the rebellious gods of Oblivion and Aedra are the benevolent gods of Nirn/Mundus, as far as I know that the only difference.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote: I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.

      Because they are barbarians? Ulfric do not understand how people can win against a defense with good level mortars, wizards and bow.

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    • The only freedom the Stormcloaks are fighting for is the legislation of heretical worship of Talos and to rid Skyrim of the Thalmor. Why would any outsider fight for the same?

      The Stormcloaks are fighting for a land for Nords and Nords only whereas...

      the Empire is better for everyone else.

      It's as simple as that.  

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    • wow - guess I'm not the only one to be torn in the civil war quests. I've never been able to support either faction (over 1'000 hours on 5 games) and as such never completed the questline. Religious intolerance or racial hatred...... neither thanks, but I do kill the thalmor whenever I find them roaming.

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    • Queegs requiem wrote:
      wow - guess I'm not the only one to be torn in the civil war quests. I've never been able to support either faction (over 1'000 hours on 5 games) and as such never completed the questline. Religious intolerance or racial hatred...... neither thanks, but I do kill the thalmor whenever I find them roaming.

      The Religious Intolerance is only until the Empire can overthrow the Dominion, it isn't permanent.

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:
       
      The Religious Intolerance is only until the Empire can overthrow the Dominion, it isn't permanent.

      Thanks - perhaps those 40 achievement points can be mine after all - it'll feel strange supporting the Empire with my shrine of Talos in the basement though


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    • Queegs requiem wrote:
      Goldflame33 wrote:
       
      The Religious Intolerance is only until the Empire can overthrow the Dominion, it isn't permanent.

      Thanks - perhaps those 40 achievement points can be mine after all - it'll feel strange supporting the Empire with my shrine of Talos in the basement though


      Try to keep your post out of the quoted person's post in the future.

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    • Empire all the way. They had to find some sort of peace and had to give a little in the process, and the Nords appear to have suffered the most from this via pride and religion. But now Skyrim and/or the Empire have the Dragonborn, they could rip up the White-Gold Concordat and throw the one man/woman army at the Third Aldmeri Dominion, crushing them once and for all. For what better weapon is there than a heavily armored, heavily weaponed Dragonborn. Backed up with a meagre 299 Nords would be even better... 

      I could invade Summerset Isles, wipe out a million Thalmor and still thirst for more Altmeri blood on my axe. 


      Also, I disagree with those saying the Stormcloaks are fighting just for their own land and they're all racist. SOME of the Stormcloaks may be racist, but most just want the Thalmor (invaders) out and to be able to worship whatever Gods they want - just like most wars! As the Empire have entered into an agreement with the Thalmor they're also seen as invaders. You can be any race and join the Stormcloaks and be welcomed, as long as you prove yourself. As I say, some Stormcloaks are racist, some Nords are racist, but not all of them. 

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    • Now thats the spirit!

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    • Long live the Empire!

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    • Down with the Dominion!

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    • Zero tolerance! Kill 'em! Kill 'em all!!!

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    • Send forward the Legions! Slaughter the proud Elves!

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    • Oh yeah.No point in fighting the empire you saved in three previous games.

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    • Correct^ years and years of saving the Empire... why waste all that time?

      Long live the Empire!

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    • To be fair it's a somewhat different Empire than the one from previous TES games. It's no longer the Septim dynasty, i.e the dynasty appointed by Akatosh himself, but the Mede dynasty, appointed by no God and who have done pretty badly so far. The bloody Empire's fallen to pieces. Damn Mehrunes Dagon and his Mythic Dawn for killing off the Septims.

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    • Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      Oh yeah.No point in fighting the empire you saved in three previous games.

      pfft, I wouldn't call it the "same" Empire.

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    • regardless, a united "Empire" is better. whether or not its the "same" it represents mans best chance against mer.

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    • Certainly a united human Empire is best, I was just pointing it's not the same Empire from previous games.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      Oh yeah.No point in fighting the empire you saved in three previous games.
      pfft, I wouldn't call it the "same" Empire.

      Hmph,so yeah,'ole Martin turned out a dragon god,Mede started to rule,not much has changed.

      Uriel Septim is pretty much almost the only true goody two shoes emperor we had.The empire has alwasy been corrupt,the empire has also decided what's best for the long term,the empire has always saved Tamriel's arse.I'm off to reading A Song of Ice and Fire now,hail to all true sons of Skyrim.

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    • Caeser Augustus wrote:
      regardless, a united "Empire" is better. whether or not its the "same" it represents mans best chance against mer.

      True a united empire would be better, but I wouldn't join this Mede run empire for personal reasons, mostly equating to the fact that the empire is sworn to protect it's people, yet it sells off a large chunk of a country, lets that country leave the empire, then when part of another country wants to leave they throw a legion and their best military mind at them, even though they are willing to fight the real enemy that the empire is supposedly training troops to fight, The WGC was supposed to grant peace so the Empire could raise troops so they can have a better chance against the 3AD, seeing as they breed and mature slower than the human races.

      It just doesn't sound like it's protecting it's citizens to me. but I do believe Emperor Titus Mede II was trying to help his people, but he gave the 3AD too much, and didn't do anything to calm it's own people before things got out of hand.

      They made too many mistakes and then tried to fix the mistakes by making more mistakes.

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    • To err is human, to forgive is divine.

      Titus Mede II is not perfect, but he trys.

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    • Caeser Augustus wrote:
      To err is human, to forgive is divine.

      Titus Mede II is not perfect, but he trys.

      I commend him for his efforts, but I condemn him for his failure.

      I wish there were any other way for things to have occured, but alas, it is too late to turn back the tides, and we must press forward on the paths that we have taken, and if our paths are to ever cross again, I would hope that we can smile as friends.

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    • I wish that moi could become the Emporer.

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    • ... moi?

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    • oh, I thought it was a name.

      and I've expressed my extreme hatred for the idea that The Last Dragonborn should become emperor, but let's not devolve this thread even more.

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    • We wants it, we needs it. Must have the precious. They stole it from us.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      ... moi?

       *Facepalm*

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      ... moi?
      *Facepalm*

      I'm sorry that I know people named Moi. that and I don't care much for the french language.

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    • Finally, everyone agrees with the one and only correct opinion.

      Empire is good for everyone residing in Skyrim, not some renegade Black Panther Army.

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    • Huzzah! Long live the Empire!

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      regardless, a united "Empire" is better. whether or not its the "same" it represents mans best chance against mer.
      True a united empire would be better, but I wouldn't join this Mede run empire for personal reasons, mostly equating to the fact that the empire is sworn to protect it's people, yet it sells off a large chunk of a country, lets that country leave the empire, then when part of another country wants to leave they throw a legion and their best military mind at them, even though they are willing to fight the real enemy that the empire is supposedly training troops to fight, The WGC was supposed to grant peace so the Empire could raise troops so they can have a better chance against the 3AD, seeing as they breed and mature slower than the human races.

      It just doesn't sound like it's protecting it's citizens to me. but I do believe Emperor Titus Mede II was trying to help his people, but he gave the 3AD too much, and didn't do anything to calm it's own people before things got out of hand.

      They made too many mistakes and then tried to fix the mistakes by making more mistakes.

      I partially agree, but without Skyrim, the Legion reinforcement in High Rock will stuck there, leaving Cyrodiil defenseless against those elves.

      Mede's death is canon, regardless whether you join the Dark Brotherhood or not. The Mottiere Family will be the next rulers. Unless Mede had a successor, it looks like the Empire will be a chicken with its head cut off for the foreseeable future.

      Anyone who wants that Emperor throne have to be either crazy or just plain stupid. It is time for Communism in Tamriel, let the Tamriel people rule themselves.

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    • The Dragonborn should use his accumulated wealth to build an army and march on Cyrodiil, overthrow whoever has inherited the throne, and vow to destroy the Thalmor threat. Heading his new Imperial army he'd take the fight directly to the Altmeri threat and slaughter them in their beds. He'd route out every last Altmer and put them down so that there isn't a "special one" that comes along in the future that would threaten man again.

      Upon his death, many years later, he would ascend to become the tenth Divine and, given the Altmer would be extinct, everyone throughout Tamriel would be free to worship him, as they did in life.

      How I wish this was a DLC.  

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    • Tange S wrote:
      The Dragonborn should use his accumulated wealth to build an army and march on Cyrodiil, overthrow whoever has inherited the throne, and vow to destroy the Thalmor threat. Heading his new Imperial army he'd take the fight directly to the Altmeri threat and slaughter them in their beds. He'd route out every last Altmer and put them down so that there isn't a "special one" that comes along in the future that would threaten man again.

      Upon his death, many years later, he would ascend to become the tenth Divine and, given the Altmer would be extinct, everyone throughout Tamriel would be free to worship him, as they did in life.

      How I wish this was a DLC.  

      No deal,The hero is ALWAYS the forgotten sucker.With the exception of the literal Hero,but the guy turned out a daedric prince.Bethesda will never allow players to have our sorry arses bathed in glory,it is not her way.I wish you people could understand that. 

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    • I understand, but it doesn't stop me wishing!

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    • The Empire. It seems Ulfric actually wants Skyrim to go to the hands of the Dominion. The Dominion are more powerful then the Stormcloaks by miles and Ulfric still thinks that he could win a war with them. That is just stupid. All he has is some drunk barbarians and the Dominion have thousands of High Elves, Khajiits, and Wood Elves that are the best in the world at magic, thievery, and archery. They also have the strongest Navy in the world. There is no way that Ulfric can stand a chance against them. He's just weakening the Empire and himself which gives the Dominion a higher chance of taking over Tamriel. Skyrim is doomed if you joined the Stormcloaks. DOWN WITH ULFRIC!!!!! FOR THE EMPIRE!!!!!

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    • Tange S wrote:
      I understand, but it doesn't stop me wishing!

      it should.

      24.44.141.89 wrote: The Empire. It seems Ulfric actually wants Skyrim to go to the hands of the Dominion. The Dominion are more powerful then the Stormcloaks by miles and Ulfric still thinks that he could win a war with them. That is just stupid. All he has is some drunk barbarians and the Dominion have thousands of High Elves, Khajiits, and Wood Elves that are the best in the world at magic, thievery, and archery. They also have the strongest Navy in the world. There is no way that Ulfric can stand a chance against them. He's just weakening the Empire and himself which gives the Dominion a higher chance of taking over Tamriel. Skyrim is doomed if you joined the Stormcloaks. DOWN WITH ULFRIC!!!!! FOR THE EMPIRE!!!!!

      I'd rather die on my feet than kneel before an empire that is kneeling to those bastards.
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    • How do you double quote?

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      • quote someone
      • switch to source mode
      • copy the source
      • quote someone else
      • paste the first quote(in source mode) above or below the new source
      • tada
      • source mode is really useful if you learn how to use it.
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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      *quote someone
      • switch to source mode
      • copy the source
      • quote someone else
      • paste the first quote(in source mode) above or below the new source
      • tada
      • source mode is really useful if you learn how to use it.

      I did it!

      24.44.141.89 wrote: The Empire. It seems Ulfric actually wants Skyrim to go to the hands of the Dominion. The Dominion are more powerful then the Stormcloaks by miles and Ulfric still thinks that he could win a war with them. That is just stupid. All he has is some drunk barbarians and the Dominion have thousands of High Elves, Khajiits, and Wood Elves that are the best in the world at magic, thievery, and archery. They also have the strongest Navy in the world. There is no way that Ulfric can stand a chance against them. He's just weakening the Empire and himself which gives the Dominion a higher chance of taking over Tamriel. Skyrim is doomed if you joined the Stormcloaks. DOWN WITH ULFRIC!!!!! FOR THE EMPIRE!!!!!

      I dit it!

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.

      Really? So Ralof saving you after Alduin attacked was just an Illusion? 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.
      Really? So Ralof saving you after Alduin attacked was just an Illusion? 

      Yes.On your part.Ralof didn't saved any of us.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.

      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 

        Loading editor
    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 

      Altmer are weak in combat, yes. But do you know their true advantage? Magic. Also, Windhelm is not in the middle of Skyrim, and has a giant lake, which connects to the Sea of Ghosts right next to it.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Tange S wrote:
      I understand, but it doesn't stop me wishing!
      it should.

      24.44.141.89 wrote: The Empire. It seems Ulfric actually wants Skyrim to go to the hands of the Dominion. The Dominion are more powerful then the Stormcloaks by miles and Ulfric still thinks that he could win a war with them. That is just stupid. All he has is some drunk barbarians and the Dominion have thousands of High Elves, Khajiits, and Wood Elves that are the best in the world at magic, thievery, and archery. They also have the strongest Navy in the world. There is no way that Ulfric can stand a chance against them. He's just weakening the Empire and himself which gives the Dominion a higher chance of taking over Tamriel. Skyrim is doomed if you joined the Stormcloaks. DOWN WITH ULFRIC!!!!! FOR THE EMPIRE!!!!!

      I'd rather die on my feet than kneel before an empire that is kneeling to those bastards.

      Never mind what I said about "FOR THE EMPIRE!". I got carried away. I actually hate both. But I meant what I said about "DOWN WITH ULFRIC". Though if a gun was pointed at my head, I would go for the empire. Skyrim is done if Ulfric was the leader. It would be taken over by the dominion in a matter of weeks. Face it, the Stormcloaks won't stand a chance against the Thalmor. Lore wise.

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    • Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.
      Really? So Ralof saving you after Alduin attacked was just an Illusion? 
      Yes.On your part.Ralof didn't saved any of us.

      No matter who you follow, he helps you up directly after Alduin attacks. 

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 
      Altmer are weak in combat, yes. But do you know their true advantage? Magic. Also, Windhelm is not in the middle of Skyrim, and has a giant lake, which connects to the Sea of Ghosts right next to it.

      Yes, but that doesn't automatically make them better. 

      They would have to get through Dawnstar or Winterhold though. My point was Windhelm is not that easy to get to. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 
      Altmer are weak in combat, yes. But do you know their true advantage? Magic. Also, Windhelm is not in the middle of Skyrim, and has a giant lake, which connects to the Sea of Ghosts right next to it.
      Yes, but that doesn't automatically make them better. 

      They would have to get through Dawnstar or Winterhold though. My point was Windhelm is not that easy to get to. 

      I don't think Winterhold would really be a problem. Or, they might arrive from the South rather than the west.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.
      Really? So Ralof saving you after Alduin attacked was just an Illusion? 
      Yes.On your part.Ralof didn't saved any of us.
      No matter who you follow, he helps you up directly after Alduin attacks. 

      I think our views on "help" are entirely different on this purpose.You follow Ralof into the watchtower and jump into the inn because the journal tells you to do it.It could have done it without Ralof as well.Truth is,no one really helps you at Helgen;you just stick around.At least Hadvar instruct the citizens to not dying.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 
      Altmer are weak in combat, yes. But do you know their true advantage? Magic. Also, Windhelm is not in the middle of Skyrim, and has a giant lake, which connects to the Sea of Ghosts right next to it.
      Yes, but that doesn't automatically make them better. 

      They would have to get through Dawnstar or Winterhold though. My point was Windhelm is not that easy to get to. 

      I don't think Winterhold would really be a problem. Or, they might arrive from the South rather than the west.

      You really think the Empire would allow the Dominion's army to march righ through Cyrdoiil? 

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    • Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      The captain was just a bad captain. Hadvar and Tullius apologise for the attempted execution. Also, during Helgen, the Imperials were fighting Alduin and saving the people while the Stormcloaks just tried to save themselves.
      Really? So Ralof saving you after Alduin attacked was just an Illusion? 
      Yes.On your part.Ralof didn't saved any of us.
      No matter who you follow, he helps you up directly after Alduin attacks. 
      I think our views on "help" are entirely different on this purpose.You follow Ralof into the watchtower and jump into the inn because the journal tells you to do it.It could have done it without Ralof as well.Truth is,no one really helps you at Helgen;you just stick around.At least Hadvar instruct the citizens to not dying.

      Actually he does tell you to jump. You must just not wait long enough for him to do it. I didn't a lot of times I played the first part. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 
      Altmer are weak in combat, yes. But do you know their true advantage? Magic. Also, Windhelm is not in the middle of Skyrim, and has a giant lake, which connects to the Sea of Ghosts right next to it.
      Yes, but that doesn't automatically make them better. 

      They would have to get through Dawnstar or Winterhold though. My point was Windhelm is not that easy to get to. 

      I don't think Winterhold would really be a problem. Or, they might arrive from the South rather than the west.
      You really think the Empire would allow the Dominion's army to march righ through Cyrdoiil? 

      They say south of Tamriel, then east of Morrowind.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 
      Altmer are weak in combat, yes. But do you know their true advantage? Magic. Also, Windhelm is not in the middle of Skyrim, and has a giant lake, which connects to the Sea of Ghosts right next to it.
      Yes, but that doesn't automatically make them better. 

      They would have to get through Dawnstar or Winterhold though. My point was Windhelm is not that easy to get to. 

      I don't think Winterhold would really be a problem. Or, they might arrive from the South rather than the west.
      You really think the Empire would allow the Dominion's army to march righ through Cyrdoiil? 
      They say south of Tamriel, then east of Morrowind.

      The Dunmer hate the Dominion. So it's very unlikely they would let them go through Morrowind. 

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    • Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I agree with Draevan. Not to mention that Ulfric Stormcloak actually thinks he stands a chance against the Dominion when they have much more soldiers that are trained and more skilled in pretty much everything and they have a much bigger Navy especially since Alinor is surrounded by water. All the stromcloaks have are drunk, unorganized nords while the Dominion have High Elves, Khajjits, and wood elves that are highly skilled in atleast one thing. All the Dominion needs to do is take Windhelm and then Skyrim is screwed.
      You didn't read much lore on the Dominion or the Stormcloaks, did you? They lost a lot of soldiers in the Great War. Possibly all of them. It's one of the reasons the Stormcloaks are so angry that the Empire signed the White-Gold Concordat, because they were winning the war. Bosmer & Khajiit do not fight for the Dominion. Only Altmer, who are weak in combat. Have you spoken to Galmar Stone-Fist at the beginning of the Stormcloak questline? He speicifcally says that they only take strong, honorable, warriors into the Stormcloaks. So they're not just drunks. Yeah, good luck getting to Windhelm which is in the middle of Skyrim. 
      Altmer are weak in combat, yes. But do you know their true advantage? Magic. Also, Windhelm is not in the middle of Skyrim, and has a giant lake, which connects to the Sea of Ghosts right next to it.
      Yes, but that doesn't automatically make them better. 

      They would have to get through Dawnstar or Winterhold though. My point was Windhelm is not that easy to get to. 

      I don't think Winterhold would really be a problem. Or, they might arrive from the South rather than the west.
      You really think the Empire would allow the Dominion's army to march righ through Cyrdoiil? 
      They say south of Tamriel, then east of Morrowind.
      The Dunmer hate the Dominion. So it's very unlikely they would let them go through Morrowind. 

      They sail.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.

      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 

      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 

      I said the Dominion defeated Legions of Imperials when the Stormcloaks had trouble with one. Sure the Stormcloaks would win :P. And no, the Empire was not winning the Great War. It never stated that the Empire was winning. They just retained The Imperial City. No one was able to defeat the Dominon except Hammerfell but that was only because there weren't that many Dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. I too hate the Dominion but they would completely destroy the Stormcloaks. 

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    • I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

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    • Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      The Dominion does have a navy.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      The Dominion does have a navy.

      Post a link.

        Loading editor
    • Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      Thank you for proving my point. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Rebeling against them is the stupidest thing Ulfric could ever do. Ulfric doesn't understand how powerful the Dominion are. They could take over Skyrim in weeks if Ulfric dares to go against them.

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    • Caeser Augustus wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      The Dominion does have a navy.
      Post a link.

      The fact that they are on an island and managed to have two countries join their cause is enough.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.

      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      The Dominion does have a navy.
      Post a link.
      The fact that they are on an island and managed to have two countries join their cause is enough.

      The two countries don't fight for them. It's just the Altmer. Not even every Altmer supports them anyway. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      The Dominion does have a navy.
      Post a link.
      The fact that they are on an island and managed to have two countries join their cause is enough.
      The two countries don't fight for them. It's just the Altmer. Not even every Altmer supports them anyway. 

      Not every Nord supports the Stormcloaks. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      I said the Dominion defeated Legions of Imperials when the Stormcloaks had trouble with one. Sure the Stormcloaks would win :P. And no, the Empire was not winning the Great War. It never stated that the Empire was winning. They just retained The Imperial City. No one was able to defeat the Dominon except Hammerfell but that was only because there weren't that many Dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. I too hate the Dominion but they would completely destroy the Stormcloaks. 

      They don't have all of Skyrim on their side yet. Once they do they'll be much more powerful. Also, I highly doubt the remaining armies of the Dominion would be any bigger then one Legion. No, they destroyed everything they had. They sent two armies to attack the Empire, one for Hammerfell and one for the Imperial City. I heard the one that attacked the Imperial City was the largest ever made by Elves. And both of them we're destroyed. This had to have taken a toll on them. And since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered in these years. The Stormcloaks would destroy the Dominion, not the other way around. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.
      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 

      Enchanting is a mage thing. Nords rarely use magic. Not all Altmer are mages. Quite a few are battle mages. They wear elven armor. The Altmer should be the ones to enchant things.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      The Dominion does have a navy.
      Post a link.
      The fact that they are on an island and managed to have two countries join their cause is enough.
      The two countries don't fight for them. It's just the Altmer. Not even every Altmer supports them anyway. 
      Not every Nord supports the Stormcloaks. 

      So the Imperial Nords are just going to let Skyrim be destroyed by the Dominion? That doesn't seem likely. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.
      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 
      Enchanting is a mage thing. Nords rarely use magic. Not all Altmer are mages. Quite a few are battle mages. They wear elven armor. The Altmer should be the ones to enchant things.

      That's not true. The Nords do like some magic types. Enchanting being one of them. The ones that wear armor aren't nearly as good in magic, they aren't as good as Nords in combat ether. 

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    • Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 

      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 

      Yes but it's not like the mages will be alone. There will be a lot more than one so it won't be so easy to encircle them and then jump them.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 

      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.

      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.

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    • Whether or not the Stormcloaks can take on the Imperial Legion, can they take on the Thalmor?

      Fighting against enemies utilizing swords, shields and bows is familiar territory for the Stormcloaks because they've been in that situation before. But have they ever had to deal with Lightning, summoned Storm Atronachs and High Elven Wizards?

      They destroy the Imperial Legion and kill Tullius, and they've taken care of one faction. BUT, can they really take on the Aldmeri Dominion in the Summerset Isles? Can they?

      There's a reason why the Empire had to surrender. If they cannot win the Great War, what makes Ulfric think that the Stromcloaks can? How are they any different to Emperors' soldiers? It all comes down to instinct of survival.

      Not bravery and loyalty.  

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.

      Nope, not all the time, unless it's in a consistant flow, but those don't seem to do as much damage. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.

      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 

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    • Lord Hadron wrote:
      Whether or not the Stormcloaks can take on the Imperial Legion, can they take on the Thalmor?

      Fighting against enemies utilizing swords, shields and bows is familiar territory for the Stormcloaks because they've been in that situation before. But have they ever had to deal with Lightning, summoned Storm Atronachs and High Elven Wizards?

      They destroy the Imperial Legion and kill Tullius, and they've taken care of one faction. BUT, can they really take on the Aldmeri Dominion in the Summerset Isles? Can they?

      There's a reason why the Empire had to surrender. If they cannot win the Great War, what makes Ulfric think that the Stromcloaks can? How are they any different to Emperors' soldiers? It all comes down to instinct of survival.

      Not bravery and loyalty.  

      I already explained in other comments how the Empire could've won. Even if Ulfric can't beat the Dominion the Isles, maybe the Redguards could. They hate the Thalmor too. An alliance is not unlikely at all. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 

      They can summon daedra/atronachs to aid them in battle. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 
      They can summon daedra/atronachs to aid them in battle. 

      Those die easily, also not every Elf can do that. Altmer probably dislike Conjuration anyway because of it's connection to Oblivion. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      Whether or not the Stormcloaks can take on the Imperial Legion, can they take on the Thalmor?

      Fighting against enemies utilizing swords, shields and bows is familiar territory for the Stormcloaks because they've been in that situation before. But have they ever had to deal with Lightning, summoned Storm Atronachs and High Elven Wizards?

      They destroy the Imperial Legion and kill Tullius, and they've taken care of one faction. BUT, can they really take on the Aldmeri Dominion in the Summerset Isles? Can they?

      There's a reason why the Empire had to surrender. If they cannot win the Great War, what makes Ulfric think that the Stromcloaks can? How are they any different to Emperors' soldiers? It all comes down to instinct of survival.

      Not bravery and loyalty.  

      I already explained in other comments how the Empire could've won. Even if Ulfric can't beat the Dominion the Isles, maybe the Redguards could. They hate the Thalmor too. An alliance is not unlikely at all. 

      The Redguards had an advantage fighting off the Dominion in their homeland of Hammerfell. But why lend aid to the Nords to fight the Aldmeri Dominion, when the Stormcloaks really only want to be able to worship Talos and rid of the Thalmor in Skyrim. Why reason would the Redguard fight for the same purpose and outcome? They're not going to risk thousands of soldiers to send over to the Isles purely for the purposes of dealing with the troubles in Skyrim.

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    • I just think the Dominion would win. They have more soldiers and stronger ships. It was wrong to rebel against the Empire when it's the only thing keeping Skyrim safe from the Dominion. The civil war only weakened both sides and the Domion were laughing at them. This just gave them a higher chance of taking over Skyrim. The Stormcloaks won't stand a chance.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I just think the Dominion would win. They have more soldiers and stronger ships. It was wrong to rebel against the Empire when it's the only thing keeping Skyrim safe from the Dominion. The civil war only weakened both sides and the Domion were laughing at them. This just gave them a higher chance of taking over Skyrim. The Stormcloaks won't stand a chance.

      Very true.

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    • Lord Hadron wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      Whether or not the Stormcloaks can take on the Imperial Legion, can they take on the Thalmor?

      Fighting against enemies utilizing swords, shields and bows is familiar territory for the Stormcloaks because they've been in that situation before. But have they ever had to deal with Lightning, summoned Storm Atronachs and High Elven Wizards?

      They destroy the Imperial Legion and kill Tullius, and they've taken care of one faction. BUT, can they really take on the Aldmeri Dominion in the Summerset Isles? Can they?

      There's a reason why the Empire had to surrender. If they cannot win the Great War, what makes Ulfric think that the Stromcloaks can? How are they any different to Emperors' soldiers? It all comes down to instinct of survival.

      Not bravery and loyalty.  

      I already explained in other comments how the Empire could've won. Even if Ulfric can't beat the Dominion the Isles, maybe the Redguards could. They hate the Thalmor too. An alliance is not unlikely at all. 
      The Redguards had an advantage fighting off the Dominion in their homeland of Hammerfell. But why lend aid to the Nords to fight the Aldmeri Dominion, when the Stormcloaks really only want to be able to worship Talos and rid of the Thalmor in Skyrim. Why reason would the Redguard fight for the same purpose and outcome? They're not going to risk thousands of soldiers to send over to the Isles purely for the purposes of dealing with the troubles in Skyrim.

      Ulfric says at the end of the Stormcloak questline that the Stormcloaks will fight the Dominion where ever they are in Tamriel. The Redguards also hate the Dominion. So I would imagine they would help. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I just think the Dominion would win. They have more soldiers and stronger ships. It was wrong to rebel against the Empire when it's the only thing keeping Skyrim safe from the Dominion. The civil war only weakened both sides and the Domion were laughing at them. This just gave them a higher chance of taking over Skyrim. The Stormcloaks won't stand a chance.

      I already refuted most of these points. Read my previous comments. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 

      You do know how Chain Lightning works, right? And it's only an adept spell. They would obviously know it.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 
      You do know how Chain Lightning works, right? And it's only an adept spell. They would obviously know it.

      Of course I know it works. I'm just saying it would do less damage with gear that has some magic resistance on it. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 
      You do know how Chain Lightning works, right? And it's only an adept spell. They would obviously know it.
      Of course I know it works. I'm just saying it would do less damage with gear that has some magic resistance on it. 

      Do any Stormcloaks enchant their gear in the game?

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 
      You do know how Chain Lightning works, right? And it's only an adept spell. They would obviously know it.
      Of course I know it works. I'm just saying it would do less damage with gear that has some magic resistance on it. 
      Do any Stormcloaks enchant their gear in the game?

      No. They're way to low of a level. And that's only because they're some of the first hostile NPCs in the game (if you follow Hadvar). 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 
      You do know how Chain Lightning works, right? And it's only an adept spell. They would obviously know it.
      Of course I know it works. I'm just saying it would do less damage with gear that has some magic resistance on it. 
      Do any Stormcloaks enchant their gear in the game?
      No. They're way to low of a level. And that's only because they're some of the first hostile NPCs in the game (if you follow Hadvar). 

      And the Stormcloak Officers? Galmar?

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Okay, you got me on that post you made about the enchanting. But the Altmer can kill the Nords before they have a chance to fire an arrow with their magic. And since they attack from a range, the Nords will have a hard time hitting them with weapons. 
      Not exactly. It's more a matter of how quick you can shoot your magic or arrow. I don't think ether is faster then the other every single time. They can only attack so many at a time that some soldiers are bound to get close to them. 
      Shock magic is quicker than a bow.
      And spells such as chain lightning can hit a bunch of nords at once.
      That somewhat an advanced spell, and that's also where the Enchantments would come in. Where they could simply move out of the wayin the process of getting shocked. 
      You do know how Chain Lightning works, right? And it's only an adept spell. They would obviously know it.
      Of course I know it works. I'm just saying it would do less damage with gear that has some magic resistance on it. 
      Do any Stormcloaks enchant their gear in the game?
      No. They're way to low of a level. And that's only because they're some of the first hostile NPCs in the game (if you follow Hadvar). 
      And the Stormcloak Officers? Galmar?

      They're all pretty low levels too. Everyone in the Civil War is. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      Thank you for proving my point. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Rebeling against them is the stupidest thing Ulfric could ever do. Ulfric doesn't understand how powerful the Dominion are. They could take over Skyrim in weeks if Ulfric dares to go against them.

      Exactly. Having Nords killing other Nords does not make Skyrim stronger, but reduces the population and resources, turning the province into an easy pick for the Nazi Thalmor. The best approach would have been alliance with the tougher Redguards (Hammerfell) and then united war against the Dominion. Unfortunately Ulfric's ego was larger than his brain.

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    • Lord Hadron wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I just think the Dominion would win. They have more soldiers and stronger ships. It was wrong to rebel against the Empire when it's the only thing keeping Skyrim safe from the Dominion. The civil war only weakened both sides and the Domion were laughing at them. This just gave them a higher chance of taking over Skyrim. The Stormcloaks won't stand a chance.
      Very true.

      The Stormcloaks can get an instant "air force" from the dragons if the Dragonborn joined them. It is all depend on the player's political view. Also, if you join the Legion, it will make the Empire stronger than ever, stronger than  Septim's.

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    • Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.
      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 
      Enchanting is a mage thing. Nords rarely use magic. Not all Altmer are mages. Quite a few are battle mages. They wear elven armor. The Altmer should be the ones to enchant things.
      That's not true. The Nords do like some magic types. Enchanting being one of them. The ones that wear armor aren't nearly as good in magic, they aren't as good as Nords in combat ether. 


      also the stormcloaks are pretty much unfinished if bethesda got more time more time to impliment all the pre-made stuff to the game then most stormcloaks would wear decent heavy armor and weapons as well as allying themselves with giants and having extremly powerful mages i know this because there is an awesome mod that adds all the unfinished content that bethesda already made called The Skyrim Civil War Overhaul    

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    • 175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire

      He just does that to further his position. That's why he chose Jarls who supported him. So he could be High King.

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    • 175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire

      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?

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    • TheGreenSabre wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Caeser Augustus wrote:
      I agree, with out the economic/political/military support of the empire, Skyrim could not long stand alone.

      The stormcloaks currently have no navy(that we know of) while neither does the dominion.

      The dominion does not just have an high elf army, they also have wood elves and khajiit, a very diverse force indeed.

      Stormcloak armies are entierly made up of Nords.

      While there are many Thalmor already in Skyrim(the embassy, northwatch, college of winterhold, and not to mention random patrols) There are none known Nords/stormcloaks in the 3rdAD.

      The armies of the 3rdAD would eventually crush Skyrim.

      Sorry Nords, stay with the Empire next time.

      Thank you for proving my point. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Rebeling against them is the stupidest thing Ulfric could ever do. Ulfric doesn't understand how powerful the Dominion are. They could take over Skyrim in weeks if Ulfric dares to go against them.
      Exactly. Having Nords killing other Nords does not make Skyrim stronger, but reduces the population and resources, turning the province into an easy pick for the Nazi Thalmor. The best approach would have been alliance with the tougher Redguards (Hammerfell) and then united war against the Dominion. Unfortunately Ulfric's ego was larger than his brain.

      Exactly. What does Ulfric's ego have to do with this? He had the same idea as you, all his group's goals were was resisting the White-Gold Concordat. The Empire starting getting violent with them because so many Legion soldiers we're joining them. He only killed Torygg after his soldiers we're being attacked for years. 

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    • 175.107.177.9 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.
      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 
      Enchanting is a mage thing. Nords rarely use magic. Not all Altmer are mages. Quite a few are battle mages. They wear elven armor. The Altmer should be the ones to enchant things.
      That's not true. The Nords do like some magic types. Enchanting being one of them. The ones that wear armor aren't nearly as good in magic, they aren't as good as Nords in combat ether. 

      also the stormcloaks are pretty much unfinished if bethesda got more time more time to impliment all the pre-made stuff to the game then most stormcloaks would wear decent heavy armor and weapons as well as allying themselves with giants and having extremly powerful mages i know this because there is an awesome mod that adds all the unfinished content that bethesda already made called The Skyrim Civil War Overhaul    

      That sounds pretty cool. I'll have to look into that mod. 

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      He just does that to further his position. That's why he chose Jarls who supported him. So he could be High King.

      But then why doesn't he just make himself High King then, why is he making this so complicated. You're grasping at straws. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?

      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.
      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 
      Enchanting is a mage thing. Nords rarely use magic. Not all Altmer are mages. Quite a few are battle mages. They wear elven armor. The Altmer should be the ones to enchant things.
      That's not true. The Nords do like some magic types. Enchanting being one of them. The ones that wear armor aren't nearly as good in magic, they aren't as good as Nords in combat ether. 

      also the stormcloaks are pretty much unfinished if bethesda got more time more time to impliment all the pre-made stuff to the game then most stormcloaks would wear decent heavy armor and weapons as well as allying themselves with giants and having extremly powerful mages i know this because there is an awesome mod that adds all the unfinished content that bethesda already made called The Skyrim Civil War Overhaul    
      That sounds pretty cool. I'll have to look into that mod. 

      http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/37216//?

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.
      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 
      Enchanting is a mage thing. Nords rarely use magic. Not all Altmer are mages. Quite a few are battle mages. They wear elven armor. The Altmer should be the ones to enchant things.
      That's not true. The Nords do like some magic types. Enchanting being one of them. The ones that wear armor aren't nearly as good in magic, they aren't as good as Nords in combat ether. 

      also the stormcloaks are pretty much unfinished if bethesda got more time more time to impliment all the pre-made stuff to the game then most stormcloaks would wear decent heavy armor and weapons as well as allying themselves with giants and having extremly powerful mages i know this because there is an awesome mod that adds all the unfinished content that bethesda already made called The Skyrim Civil War Overhaul    
      That sounds pretty cool. I'll have to look into that mod. 
      http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/37216//?

      Thanks.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zipper, you actually believe that the Stormcloaks would win? The Thalmor have the strongest navy in all of Tamriel. Not to mention that Alinor is surrounded by water. They also have a bigger army and are skilled in magic which can easily beat a warrior. Take an Arch-Pyromage for instance. One can defeat a bandit chief in seconds. The Stormcloaks had trouble with one legion of Imperials. ONE! The dominion defeated a bunch of legions. Windhelm is connected to the Sea of Ghosts so you are wrong there. And the Dominion weren't the only ones weakened. The Stormcloaks were also weakened during the Civil War. The Stormcloaks would put up a good fight. But the Dominion would come on top.
      Where do you get the idea they have the best navy in Tamriel? Gameplay doesn't prove much, the Thalmor are a much higher level then the Stormcloaks because they appear later in the main quest. That's why they usually win. The Dominion was weakened far more then the Empire was. They lost basically everything they had. Read The Great War. The Dominion would not win in a war against the Stormcloaks. 
      Yes they would. They have tactics. They can fight both at range and up close effectively, without worrying about arrows. Do not underestimate the Dominion.
      The powerful mages usually have waer robes, meaning that just one hit from a weapon or arrow would kill them, while the Nords have iron & steel armor, which they can also enchant with magic resistance. 
      Enchanting is a mage thing. Nords rarely use magic. Not all Altmer are mages. Quite a few are battle mages. They wear elven armor. The Altmer should be the ones to enchant things.
      That's not true. The Nords do like some magic types. Enchanting being one of them. The ones that wear armor aren't nearly as good in magic, they aren't as good as Nords in combat ether. 

      also the stormcloaks are pretty much unfinished if bethesda got more time more time to impliment all the pre-made stuff to the game then most stormcloaks would wear decent heavy armor and weapons as well as allying themselves with giants and having extremly powerful mages i know this because there is an awesome mod that adds all the unfinished content that bethesda already made called The Skyrim Civil War Overhaul    
      That sounds pretty cool. I'll have to look into that mod. 
      http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/37216//?
      Thanks.

      You're welcome.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 

      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 

      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 

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    • Also, when you said that Atronachs die fast, that is true but they are more than enough to create a distraction.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Also, when you said that Atronachs die fast, that is true but they are more than enough to create a distraction.

      Only powerful ones are strong enough to last for a while. Like only expert conjurers can make the powerful ones. Like Daedra. I said this in another comments (it might not have been to you though) that the Altmer probably dislike Conjuration because of it's connection to Oblivion. 

        Loading editor
    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 

      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 

        Loading editor
    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Also, when you said that Atronachs die fast, that is true but they are more than enough to create a distraction.
      Only powerful ones are strong enough to last for a while. Like only expert conjurers can make the powerful ones. Like Daedra. I said this in another comments (it might not have been to you though) that the Altmer probably dislike Conjuration because of it's connection to Oblivion. 

      Yes but ones like Storm Atronach can move away and dodge the attacks. And the Altmer don't dislike conjuration. They have +5 in conjuration in Skyrim. 

        Loading editor
    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 
      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 

      That's not going to help in a war. If the Thalmor take over Tamriel Daedra worship is probably going to be made illegal. So I definitely think they'll fight the Dominion. Also, why won't they help the Nords? Forsworn are NOT a lot of Bretons. If anything, they're considered outcasts to normal Breton society. You can just keep saying how they're so strong, but if you give no evidence. It's meaningless. What is some evidene that the Thalmor is as strong as you're claiming. Also, I already refuted why Hammerfell wouldn't just leave Skyrim to die. Why did you just ignore that? 

        Loading editor
    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Also, when you said that Atronachs die fast, that is true but they are more than enough to create a distraction.
      Only powerful ones are strong enough to last for a while. Like only expert conjurers can make the powerful ones. Like Daedra. I said this in another comments (it might not have been to you though) that the Altmer probably dislike Conjuration because of it's connection to Oblivion. 
      Yes but ones like Storm Atronach can move away and dodge the attacks. And the Altmer don't dislike conjuration. They have +5 in conjuration in Skyrim. 

      They have +5 in every magic thing in Skyrim. As I said the Altmer think of the Daedra as pathetic demons who are unworthy of worship so they probably don't like to assosiate with their realm of Oblivion. Even if they do summon some Storm Atronachs they could still be destroyed in possibly a couple arrows or spells even. 

        Loading editor
    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 
      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 
      That's not going to help in a war. If the Thalmor take over Tamriel Daedra worship is probably going to be made illegal. So I definitely think they'll fight the Dominion. Also, why won't they help the Nords? Forsworn are NOT a lot of Bretons. If anything, they're considered outcasts to normal Breton society. You can just keep saying how they're so strong, but if you give no evidence. It's meaningless. What is some evidene that the Thalmor is as strong as you're claiming. Also, I already refuted why Hammerfell wouldn't just leave Skyrim to die. Why did you just ignore that? 

      WHere does it say that they hate Daedra?

        Loading editor
    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Also, when you said that Atronachs die fast, that is true but they are more than enough to create a distraction.
      Only powerful ones are strong enough to last for a while. Like only expert conjurers can make the powerful ones. Like Daedra. I said this in another comments (it might not have been to you though) that the Altmer probably dislike Conjuration because of it's connection to Oblivion. 
      Yes but ones like Storm Atronach can move away and dodge the attacks. And the Altmer don't dislike conjuration. They have +5 in conjuration in Skyrim. 
      They have +5 in every magic thing in Skyrim. As I said the Altmer think of the Daedra as pathetic demons who are unworthy of worship so they probably don't like to assosiate with their realm of Oblivion. Even if they do summon some Storm Atronachs they could still be destroyed in possibly a couple arrows or spells even. 

      You don't know the don't like it.Anyway, Storm Atronachs are far more powerful than you think.

        Loading editor
    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 
      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 
      That's not going to help in a war. If the Thalmor take over Tamriel Daedra worship is probably going to be made illegal. So I definitely think they'll fight the Dominion. Also, why won't they help the Nords? Forsworn are NOT a lot of Bretons. If anything, they're considered outcasts to normal Breton society. You can just keep saying how they're so strong, but if you give no evidence. It's meaningless. What is some evidene that the Thalmor is as strong as you're claiming. Also, I already refuted why Hammerfell wouldn't just leave Skyrim to die. Why did you just ignore that? 
      WHere does it say that they hate Daedra?

      They expelled some High Elves from the Isles for worshipping Daedra. They also considered Aedra to be their ancestors, so I would imagine they consider worship of anything else to be blasphmous. 

        Loading editor
    • Man of steak wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Also, when you said that Atronachs die fast, that is true but they are more than enough to create a distraction.
      Only powerful ones are strong enough to last for a while. Like only expert conjurers can make the powerful ones. Like Daedra. I said this in another comments (it might not have been to you though) that the Altmer probably dislike Conjuration because of it's connection to Oblivion. 
      Yes but ones like Storm Atronach can move away and dodge the attacks. And the Altmer don't dislike conjuration. They have +5 in conjuration in Skyrim. 
      They have +5 in every magic thing in Skyrim. As I said the Altmer think of the Daedra as pathetic demons who are unworthy of worship so they probably don't like to assosiate with their realm of Oblivion. Even if they do summon some Storm Atronachs they could still be destroyed in possibly a couple arrows or spells even. 
      You don't know the don't like it.Anyway, Storm Atronachs are far more powerful than you think.

      How do you know they're more powerful then I think? Have you fought one of them personally? o.O

        Loading editor
    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Man of steak wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Also, when you said that Atronachs die fast, that is true but they are more than enough to create a distraction.
      Only powerful ones are strong enough to last for a while. Like only expert conjurers can make the powerful ones. Like Daedra. I said this in another comments (it might not have been to you though) that the Altmer probably dislike Conjuration because of it's connection to Oblivion. 
      Yes but ones like Storm Atronach can move away and dodge the attacks. And the Altmer don't dislike conjuration. They have +5 in conjuration in Skyrim. 
      They have +5 in every magic thing in Skyrim. As I said the Altmer think of the Daedra as pathetic demons who are unworthy of worship so they probably don't like to assosiate with their realm of Oblivion. Even if they do summon some Storm Atronachs they could still be destroyed in possibly a couple arrows or spells even. 
      You don't know the don't like it.Anyway, Storm Atronachs are far more powerful than you think.
      How do you know they're more powerful then I think? Have you fought one of them personally? o.O

      Yeah.Yesterday.I became a lightning rod.

        Loading editor
    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 
      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 
      That's not going to help in a war. If the Thalmor take over Tamriel Daedra worship is probably going to be made illegal. So I definitely think they'll fight the Dominion. Also, why won't they help the Nords? Forsworn are NOT a lot of Bretons. If anything, they're considered outcasts to normal Breton society. You can just keep saying how they're so strong, but if you give no evidence. It's meaningless. What is some evidene that the Thalmor is as strong as you're claiming. Also, I already refuted why Hammerfell wouldn't just leave Skyrim to die. Why did you just ignore that? 
      WHere does it say that they hate Daedra?
      They expelled some High Elves from the Isles for worshipping Daedra. They also considered Aedra to be their ancestors, so I would imagine they consider worship of anything else to be blasphmous. 

      Can I get a source for the first thing? I'm actually curious.

        Loading editor
    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 
      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 
      That's not going to help in a war. If the Thalmor take over Tamriel Daedra worship is probably going to be made illegal. So I definitely think they'll fight the Dominion. Also, why won't they help the Nords? Forsworn are NOT a lot of Bretons. If anything, they're considered outcasts to normal Breton society. You can just keep saying how they're so strong, but if you give no evidence. It's meaningless. What is some evidene that the Thalmor is as strong as you're claiming. Also, I already refuted why Hammerfell wouldn't just leave Skyrim to die. Why did you just ignore that? 
      WHere does it say that they hate Daedra?
      They expelled some High Elves from the Isles for worshipping Daedra. They also considered Aedra to be their ancestors, so I would imagine they consider worship of anything else to be blasphmous. 
      Can I get a source for the first thing? I'm actually curious.

      Sources for what? The Thalmor kicking them out the Dunmer for worshipping Daedra or the Altmer thinking the Aedra are their ancestors? 

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    • I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 
      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 
      That's not going to help in a war. If the Thalmor take over Tamriel Daedra worship is probably going to be made illegal. So I definitely think they'll fight the Dominion. Also, why won't they help the Nords? Forsworn are NOT a lot of Bretons. If anything, they're considered outcasts to normal Breton society. You can just keep saying how they're so strong, but if you give no evidence. It's meaningless. What is some evidene that the Thalmor is as strong as you're claiming. Also, I already refuted why Hammerfell wouldn't just leave Skyrim to die. Why did you just ignore that? 
      WHere does it say that they hate Daedra?
      They expelled some High Elves from the Isles for worshipping Daedra. They also considered Aedra to be their ancestors, so I would imagine they consider worship of anything else to be blasphmous. 
      Can I get a source for the first thing? I'm actually curious.
      Sources for what? The Thalmor kicking them out the Dunmer for worshipping Daedra or the Altmer thinking the Aedra are their ancestors? 

      Them kicking the Daedra worshippers out.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.

      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      175.107.177.9 wrote:

      Al Wolf2200 wrote: Oh God, another one of these threads.

      Skyrim could survive without the empire if need be, but if they were to do so Ulfric (the selfish bigot that he is) shouldn't be the one in charge. Skyrim is better off as a part of the empire than a free territory under Ulfrics rule, simple as that. I could explain why but I really don't feel like tossing in a few paragraphs that are already posted on other threads.

      Ulfric Selfish? maybe you should see what he does at the end of the stormcloak questline he rejects the position of high-king and says only the moot will decide also stormcloaks despite having slightly worse armor kick imperials asses (I've seen great examples of that with random encounters) also the stormcloaks are trying to ally themselves with the redguards since they both hate the thalmor and empire like hell I'd say that it would more likely that not equal a powerful alliance that would give the thalmor and empire a major ass whooping and i dont see the empire forming alliances because there isn't a single province that doesn't hate them in some way (and no the thalmor are NOT true allies those elven pricks would destroy the empire from the inside as soon as they got the chance also they are too weak to go take over any countries so if you actually take a GOOD look at the facts the stormcloaks would be way better for skyrim than the empire
      Right. I think Skyrim is way better off with Elves walking on it's ground :P. The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim protected from those elven assholes. And they are not weak. They could destroy Ulfric's puny army in a matter of weeks. If the Stormcloaks were to go against them, they would be crushed. Do not underestimate the Dominion. The Empire couldn't beat them. What makes you think they can?
      The Empire is the only reason they're in Skyrim! This "puny army" is what beat the Dominion in the Great War, when they served the Legion. The Empire could, why do you keep stubbornly insisting they couldn't despite the fact that I've given evidence to prove it, but you've given none? 
      Some of the "evidence" you gave is untrue. Like when you said the Dominion were losing the Great War even though that's not true. Just because the Imperials regained The Imperial City doesn't mean they were winning. The only reason Hammerfell won against the Dominion is because there weren't that many dominion soldiers in Hammerfell and the Empire was helping them. They didn't even kill all the dominion soldiers in Hammerfell. Only about 3/4. Skyrim alone couldn't beat the dominion. If they were to make an alliance with Hammerfell then maybe they could. But I'm pretty sure that they won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. They have their own business. Morrowind, High Rock, and Black Marsh try not to care. Elsweyr and Valenwood are controlled by the Dominion. Cyrodill would never help the Stromcloaks after they went to war with them. And like I said, Hammerfell won't risk thousands of soldiers just to help the Stormcloaks. So it's just Skyrim alone. 
      The army the Dominion lost was the largest in Elven history. This had to have taken a toll on them. Since Elves reproduce slower, they have probably barely recovered. Skyrim could beat the Dominion. Hammerfell hates the Dominion just as much as the Stormcloaks, so they probably would help destroy them. Morrowind hates them too. The Stormcloaks offered an alliance to High Rock, they haven't responded, but they didn't instantly reject it. 
      But elves also live longer. And Morrowind doesn't really care. Sure, they hate the Dominion but they would never help the nords. They just care about those Daedric Princes they worship. And High Rock doesn't care either. Especially when a lot of Bretons are trying to regain the Reach. The three Neutral Provinces are Black Marsh, Morrowind, and High Rock and they will most likely not help the Nords. Especially Black Marsh. Hammerfell is possible but still unlikely. The Dominion has a stronger army even when a lot of it was destroyed during the great war. They took over the Imperial City and left Cyrodill in ruins. This is proably the reason the Stromcloaks were able to beat them. And none were winning the Great War. 
      That's not going to help in a war. If the Thalmor take over Tamriel Daedra worship is probably going to be made illegal. So I definitely think they'll fight the Dominion. Also, why won't they help the Nords? Forsworn are NOT a lot of Bretons. If anything, they're considered outcasts to normal Breton society. You can just keep saying how they're so strong, but if you give no evidence. It's meaningless. What is some evidene that the Thalmor is as strong as you're claiming. Also, I already refuted why Hammerfell wouldn't just leave Skyrim to die. Why did you just ignore that? 
      WHere does it say that they hate Daedra?
      They expelled some High Elves from the Isles for worshipping Daedra. They also considered Aedra to be their ancestors, so I would imagine they consider worship of anything else to be blasphmous. 
      Can I get a source for the first thing? I'm actually curious.
      Sources for what? The Thalmor kicking them out the Dunmer for worshipping Daedra or the Altmer thinking the Aedra are their ancestors? 
      Them kicking the Daedra worshippers out.

      Read the lore of the Chimer. It explains how they had to leave the Isles and go to Morrowind because they worshipped Daedra. 

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    • No....They left of their own accord and Trinimac tried to stop them.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 

      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.

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    • I think Empire wins.Ulfrics Thu'um has no advantage against the Thalmor.The empire has lots of soldiers that are disciplined while ulfrics so called rebellion has only drunkards and racist nords without any (mostly) battle expirience

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 
      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.

      If by regaining that land they successfully wiped out the enemies army, then yes.

      the dominion didn't "take over" they tricked them into joining them.

      you're acting as if only 1/100 of the dominions forces were lost; this was THE LARGEST ARMY OF ELVES... EVER


      yes, the stormcloaks probably would have lost without the dragonborn, but guess what, they didn't have any economical back up, The Legion was getting money and weapons from cyrodiil, what that means is that these weak Stormcloak soldiers were fending off a single legion(LED BY THE GREATEST MILITARY MIND IN THE EMPIRE) with weaker weapons and armor, while said legion was getting monetary and economic aid from Cyrodiil.

      And if the Stormcloaks win, Guess who's left in the empire: NOBODY; The only countrys left in the empire are Skyrim(which would obviously leave the empire after they win) Cyrodiil, and Highrock; but guess what, Highrock is cut off from cyrodiil, forcing them to either fight Skyrim or Hammerfell, or joining them, AND YES, Skyrim would join with Hammerfell, there is literally no reason for them not to band together. 

      Then what happens to Cyrodiil (it's not an empire anymore)? The Dominion would see a weak empire, the best time to strike, are they going to chose to fight the dominion on their own, or are they willing to suck up their pride so they can do what they should have done thirty years ago when proposed with the White-Gold Concordant, Spit in the face of the Thalmor and wipe them out?

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    • Man of steak wrote:
      No....They left of their own accord and Trinimac tried to stop them.

      I definitely know they wrre treated poorly though, that might have been the reason they left. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 
      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.

      The Dominion put everything into that attack! If they had the Imperial City they would've controlled Tamriel. But all of it was destroyed, they simply don't have the mer power to defend the Isles. The only thing that is protecting them is the Empire now. Yes, basically 11/12 of the Dominion's army was destroyed. Because the one that attcked Cyrodiil was said to be largest assembled by Elves. Why do you think that? Both sides seemed pretty equal in the war. The Empire was not doing any better then the Stormcloaks. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 
      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.
      The Dominion put everything into that attack! If they had the Imperial City they would've controlled Tamriel. But all of it was destroyed, they simply don't have the mer power to defend the Isles. The only thing that is protecting them is the Empire now. Yes, basically 11/12 of the Dominion's army was destroyed. Because the one that attcked Cyrodiil was said to be largest assembled by Elves. Why do you think that? Both sides seemed pretty equal in the war. The Empire was not doing any better then the Stormcloaks. 

      If you joined the Stormcloaks, they would win. If you joined the Empire, they would win. But if you joined none, The Empire would win lore wise. The Empire has better equipment and better men. And no. 11/12 of the Dominion wasn't destroyed. About 8/12 was destroyed. Why do you think that? Why do you think the Dominion is that weak? 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Man of steak wrote:
      No....They left of their own accord and Trinimac tried to stop them.
      I definitely know they wrre treated poorly though, that might have been the reason they left. 

      I read the page on Chimer. It doesn't say that they were treated badly.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 
      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.
      The Dominion put everything into that attack! If they had the Imperial City they would've controlled Tamriel. But all of it was destroyed, they simply don't have the mer power to defend the Isles. The only thing that is protecting them is the Empire now. Yes, basically 11/12 of the Dominion's army was destroyed. Because the one that attcked Cyrodiil was said to be largest assembled by Elves. Why do you think that? Both sides seemed pretty equal in the war. The Empire was not doing any better then the Stormcloaks. 
      If you joined the Stormcloaks, they would win. If you joined the Empire, they would win. But if you joined none, The Empire would win lore wise. The Empire has better equipment and better men. And no. 11/12 of the Dominion wasn't destroyed. About 8/12 was destroyed. Why do you think that? Why do you think the Dominion is that weak? 

      Better men? Why are you insulting the Legion veterans that beat the Dominion in the Great War? Lore wise, the Stormcloaks probably have access to iron and steel as well as Skyforge Steel that might've been sent to them by Eourlund. The Dominion was not that weak, but they just put everything into there attack on Cyrodiil and all of it was destroyed. It was a tough fight, but the Empire pulled through. 

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Man of steak wrote:
      No....They left of their own accord and Trinimac tried to stop them.
      I definitely know they wrre treated poorly though, that might have been the reason they left. 
      I read the page on Chimer. It doesn't say that they were treated badly.

      On the Wiki or UESP? Anyway, why do you think the Dunmer would hate the Thalmor? Just for the hell of it? No. Probably because they consider Daedra worshippers no better then Talos worshippers. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 
      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.
      The Dominion put everything into that attack! If they had the Imperial City they would've controlled Tamriel. But all of it was destroyed, they simply don't have the mer power to defend the Isles. The only thing that is protecting them is the Empire now. Yes, basically 11/12 of the Dominion's army was destroyed. Because the one that attcked Cyrodiil was said to be largest assembled by Elves. Why do you think that? Both sides seemed pretty equal in the war. The Empire was not doing any better then the Stormcloaks. 
      If you joined the Stormcloaks, they would win. If you joined the Empire, they would win. But if you joined none, The Empire would win lore wise. The Empire has better equipment and better men. And no. 11/12 of the Dominion wasn't destroyed. About 8/12 was destroyed. Why do you think that? Why do you think the Dominion is that weak? 
      Better men? Why are you insulting the Legion veterans that beat the Dominion in the Great War? Lore wise, the Stormcloaks probably have access to iron and steel as well as Skyforge Steel that might've been sent to them by Eourlund. The Dominion was not that weak, but they just put everything into there attack on Cyrodiil and all of it was destroyed. It was a tough fight, but the Empire pulled through. 

      Balgruuf wouldn't let the steel be exported to the Stormcloaks.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 
      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.
      The Dominion put everything into that attack! If they had the Imperial City they would've controlled Tamriel. But all of it was destroyed, they simply don't have the mer power to defend the Isles. The only thing that is protecting them is the Empire now. Yes, basically 11/12 of the Dominion's army was destroyed. Because the one that attcked Cyrodiil was said to be largest assembled by Elves. Why do you think that? Both sides seemed pretty equal in the war. The Empire was not doing any better then the Stormcloaks. 
      If you joined the Stormcloaks, they would win. If you joined the Empire, they would win. But if you joined none, The Empire would win lore wise. The Empire has better equipment and better men. And no. 11/12 of the Dominion wasn't destroyed. About 8/12 was destroyed. Why do you think that? Why do you think the Dominion is that weak? 
      Better men? Why are you insulting the Legion veterans that beat the Dominion in the Great War? Lore wise, the Stormcloaks probably have access to iron and steel as well as Skyforge Steel that might've been sent to them by Eourlund. The Dominion was not that weak, but they just put everything into there attack on Cyrodiil and all of it was destroyed. It was a tough fight, but the Empire pulled through. 
      Balgruuf wouldn't let the steel be exported to the Stormcloaks.

      Balgruuf had no intention to help or stop either side, he didn't want any part of it, only until just before the battle of whiterun, which is basically where the war really ends, and if the stormcloaks win there then Balgruuf isn't able to stop Eorlund from supplying Skyforge steel weapons.

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    • You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

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    • Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 

      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 
      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.

      The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Why would the Stormcloaks want to fight them when they're trying to help them? The Empire is best for Skyrim. The Stormcloaks started this war, not the Empire. Ulfric just had to kill the High King.

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    • Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      The rebels aren't looking at the big picture. They only focus on getting back Talos worship and if they win, they get it for a while until the dominion coes, conquers and shows them true oppression.

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    • In Sovngard, Ulfric states that he regrets rebelling against the Empire, as it diverted it's attention away from the Aldmeri Dominion and towards Skyrim.  

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    • Immortal Wizard wrote:
      In Sovngard, Ulfric states that he regrets rebelling against the Empire, as it diverted it's attention away from the Aldmeri Dominion and towards Skyrim.  

      Try telling that to the Stormcloaks around here.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      I already told you why the Thalmor are so strong. They took over the Imperial City ad left Cyrodill in ruins. And some of the things you exaggerate. Such as the empire was winning.
      Yes, they did do that. And as I said, the Empire beat every soldier they sent to Cyrodiil. Can you please give some proof how you know they have some soldiers left? 
      The empire wasn't winning. Regaining a land that the enemy took doesn't mean you're winning. The Empire is still rebuilding Cyrodill. The Dominion took over Elsweyr and Valenwood. They are indeed powerful. You're acting like 11/12 of the Dominion was completely destroyed during the Great War. That's not true. Why do you think the Stormcloaks won if you joined them? Because you're the Dragonborn. If you didn't join either side, the Empire would have creamed the Stormcloaks. The first time the Dominion tried to take over Cyrodill was succesful.
      The Dominion put everything into that attack! If they had the Imperial City they would've controlled Tamriel. But all of it was destroyed, they simply don't have the mer power to defend the Isles. The only thing that is protecting them is the Empire now. Yes, basically 11/12 of the Dominion's army was destroyed. Because the one that attcked Cyrodiil was said to be largest assembled by Elves. Why do you think that? Both sides seemed pretty equal in the war. The Empire was not doing any better then the Stormcloaks. 
      If you joined the Stormcloaks, they would win. If you joined the Empire, they would win. But if you joined none, The Empire would win lore wise. The Empire has better equipment and better men. And no. 11/12 of the Dominion wasn't destroyed. About 8/12 was destroyed. Why do you think that? Why do you think the Dominion is that weak? 
      Better men? Why are you insulting the Legion veterans that beat the Dominion in the Great War? Lore wise, the Stormcloaks probably have access to iron and steel as well as Skyforge Steel that might've been sent to them by Eourlund. The Dominion was not that weak, but they just put everything into there attack on Cyrodiil and all of it was destroyed. It was a tough fight, but the Empire pulled through. 
      Balgruuf wouldn't let the steel be exported to the Stormcloaks.

      Whiterun wasen't always an Imperial Hold. 

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    • Immortal Wizard wrote:
      In Sovngard, Ulfric states that he regrets rebelling against the Empire, as it diverted it's attention away from the Aldmeri Dominion and towards Skyrim.  

      Biggest myth ever (except for maybe the Stormcloak racism). Ulfric just says how he feels sad that the war has strengthened Alduin by sending a lot of Nords to Sovngarde. Nothing about being wrong. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Immortal Wizard wrote:
      In Sovngard, Ulfric states that he regrets rebelling against the Empire, as it diverted it's attention away from the Aldmeri Dominion and towards Skyrim.  
      Try telling that to the Stormcloaks around here.

      Yeah, most of us can see through that lie. 

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 
      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.
      The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Why would the Stormcloaks want to fight them when they're trying to help them? The Empire is best for Skyrim. The Stormcloaks started this war, not the Empire. Ulfric just had to kill the High King.

      The Empire keeping Skyrim safe by killing their military.

      Also, The war was going on for a while before Ulfric killed Toryyg.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 
      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.
      The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Why would the Stormcloaks want to fight them when they're trying to help them? The Empire is best for Skyrim. The Stormcloaks started this war, not the Empire. Ulfric just had to kill the High King.

      The Empire is only thing keeping the Dominion in power! I've given evidence as to why they could've won but you're just ignoreing it for some reason. The Empire is not helping them by standing by while the Dominion oppresses the people. That's why Ulfric killed Torygg because he allowed all of this to happen to the people. 

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 
      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.
      The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Why would the Stormcloaks want to fight them when they're trying to help them? The Empire is best for Skyrim. The Stormcloaks started this war, not the Empire. Ulfric just had to kill the High King.
      The Empire is only thing keeping the Dominion in power! I've given evidence as to why they could've won but you're just ignoreing it for some reason. The Empire is not helping them by standing by while the Dominion oppresses the people. That's why Ulfric killed Torygg because he allowed all of this to happen to the people. 

      That was only until the Enpire was strong enough to repel the Dominion!

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 
      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.
      The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Why would the Stormcloaks want to fight them when they're trying to help them? The Empire is best for Skyrim. The Stormcloaks started this war, not the Empire. Ulfric just had to kill the High King.
      The Empire is only thing keeping the Dominion in power! I've given evidence as to why they could've won but you're just ignoreing it for some reason. The Empire is not helping them by standing by while the Dominion oppresses the people. That's why Ulfric killed Torygg because he allowed all of this to happen to the people. 
      That was only until the Enpire was strong enough to repel the Dominion!

      The Stormcloaks are the Legion veterans that orginally beat the Dominion in the Great War. 

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    • TheGreenSabre wrote:
      I know, the prologue made it rather hard to go Imperial, but once in the game politics we not so sure.. We cannot blame the Stormcloaks for being a little bit miffed at outsiders or racist towards elves. Skyrim is their ancestral homeland and the Nords having to deal with an outside influence trying to ban the worship of one of their own native sons and greatest heroes for the sake of appeasing another group of foreigners. won't take sides. my previous character sided with the Stormcloaks. Personally, I despise Mede Empire and the crappy White-Gold Concordat. The Empire we knew died with the Remans/Septims,


      Each has their own fault. Stormcloaks are clearly more powerful in terms of Skyrim politics over the Imperials as the Empire has gone to $hit since Oblivion. They are likw the Germanic people who fought the Romans 2000 years ago. The Stormcloaks would make better rulers in terms of a more stable government, but they are extremely provocative. Only Nords would get fair treatment which is not right.  The Thalmor does not want either side to win. The elves want the civil war to continue until both sides are weakened, and then swoop down on both, creating an Ayleid-ish Empire. So the Thalmor are puppeteering both sides.

      The Empire became puppets of the Thalmor which seek to return Tamriel to the days of Ayleid rule when they enslaved Men. Thalmor is strong n my opinion and an Empire that is so weak that they just accept the terms of these devious elves is no Empire I like. If the Empire still had a strong Emperor in place and refused to the Thalmor in Skyrim. And the Imperials tried to execute you in the beginning with no fair trial which is a dick move in my opinion. The end result is still the same douchebag guards who arrest you when there is a bounty.

      I find that I disagree with you so vehemently that I cannot take place in this argument. sorry.

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    • Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Goldflame33 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 
      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.
      The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Why would the Stormcloaks want to fight them when they're trying to help them? The Empire is best for Skyrim. The Stormcloaks started this war, not the Empire. Ulfric just had to kill the High King.
      The Empire is only thing keeping the Dominion in power! I've given evidence as to why they could've won but you're just ignoreing it for some reason. The Empire is not helping them by standing by while the Dominion oppresses the people. That's why Ulfric killed Torygg because he allowed all of this to happen to the people. 
      That was only until the Enpire was strong enough to repel the Dominion!
      The Stormcloaks are the Legion veterans that orginally beat the Dominion in the Great War. 

      They never beat them. No one won in the Great War. The Empire ended it after seeing what it has costed them.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      Goldflame33 wrote:
      Zippertrain85 wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Lord Hadron wrote:
      You know what I don't understand. why are the Stormcloaks killing the Imperial Legion?

      The only thing the Empire did was make a decision. Why? Because they were losing a war to the Dominion. Yet the Stormcloaks are killing them for this. Killing their own people. No matter how cowardly the Empire may seem, who's the real enemy here? Ulfric acts as though the Empire is the only problem here.

      The Aldmeri Dominion.

      If the Stormcloaks win, what then? The Dominion no longer need to worry about the Empire because they have been destroyed by Ulfric and his rebellion. Therefore, the Dominion can NOW focus ALL their attention into destroying the Stormcloak rebellion.

      Is the rebellion prepared for what they're getting themselves into? 

      Thank you. Someone who finally understands. 
      Why are you blaming the Stormcloaks for this? The Stormcloaks aren't the ones who sent a legion to skyrim. They're not the ones who are fighting a pointless war, right now, they're just trying to rid themselves of the Empire that is attacking them.
      The Empire is the only thing keeping Skyrim safe. Why would the Stormcloaks want to fight them when they're trying to help them? The Empire is best for Skyrim. The Stormcloaks started this war, not the Empire. Ulfric just had to kill the High King.
      The Empire is only thing keeping the Dominion in power! I've given evidence as to why they could've won but you're just ignoreing it for some reason. The Empire is not helping them by standing by while the Dominion oppresses the people. That's why Ulfric killed Torygg because he allowed all of this to happen to the people. 
      That was only until the Enpire was strong enough to repel the Dominion!
      The Stormcloaks are the Legion veterans that orginally beat the Dominion in the Great War. 
      They never beat them. No one won in the Great War. The Empire ended it after seeing what it has costed them.

      They we're going to though. Since the Dominion basically had nothing left. 

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    • you are all making way too many assumptions.

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    • Someone make a thread about Stormcloaks vs Dominion so we could argue over there. Not here. We're going way off topic.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Someone make a thread about Stormcloaks vs Dominion so we could argue over there. Not here. We're going way off topic.

      there are already a ton of them, so no, just look for and revive an old one

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    • Haven't seen one yet. But does it matter? There are a ton of "Legion vs Stormcloaks" threads and this person decided to make another one. I won't make one. Just asking.

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    • I have a question that's off topic. Should I play as Lydia's twin sister or Ulfric's twin brother?

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      Haven't seen one yet. But does it matter? There are a ton of "Legion vs Stormcloaks" threads and this person decided to make another one. I won't make one. Just asking.

      I know, I asked for any conversation in this thread to move to another thread that already has conversation in it, but then this thread exploded, so it's too late to move the conversation to an older thread, and deleting this one.

      but if anyone WANTS to have a conversation about that, I'd reccomend reviving an old thread instead of creating ANOTHER one for the same topic.

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    • Ulfric because if you join the Stormcloaks and win, people will think that you're the soon-to-be High King.

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    • Pickleseller wrote:
      I have a question that's off topic. Should I play as Lydia's twin sister or Ulfric's twin brother?

      ... Why not Ulfric AND Lydia's Half-Sibling?

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      I have a question that's off topic. Should I play as Lydia's twin sister or Ulfric's twin brother?
      ... Why not Ulfric AND Lydia's Half-Sibling?

      Lydia Stormcloak?

        Loading editor
    • Pickleseller wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      I have a question that's off topic. Should I play as Lydia's twin sister or Ulfric's twin brother?
      ... Why not Ulfric AND Lydia's Half-Sibling?
      Lydia Stormcloak?

      If you want, she could be against her (head-canon) Step Brother's views.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      Pickleseller wrote:
      I have a question that's off topic. Should I play as Lydia's twin sister or Ulfric's twin brother?
      ... Why not Ulfric AND Lydia's Half-Sibling?
      Lydia Stormcloak?
      If you want, she could be against her (head-canon) Step Brother's views.

      Lydia Stormcloak. She grew up with her brother Ulfric and her twin sister Lydia.

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    • Well, I can't seem to find an older one. I'll keep looking.

        Loading editor
    • OMFG I just found a secret quest in Skyrim!!!!

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    • http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:253846

      Just start talking in this one, somone is bound to call you an idiot, then someone might say why you're right, no matter what side you chose.

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    • 24.44.141.89 wrote:
      OMFG I just found a secret quest in Skyrim!!!!

      which one?

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Thread:253846

      Just start talking in this one, somone is bound to call you an idiot, then someone might say why you're right, no matter what side you chose.

      Nah. I'm tired of this whole Civil War argument. 

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      24.44.141.89 wrote:
      OMFG I just found a secret quest in Skyrim!!!!
      which one?

      I lied. I know, now I seem like a troll. But I just wanted to try it out.

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    • Stormcloaks did what they felt was right. To allow someone to govern your heritage is not the way. Ulfric Stormcloak arrogant? Not necessarily. He is however confident that he can defeat the Thalmor. The only way we are going to know if either side can beat the Thalmor is if Bethesda(?)Games makes an Elder Scrolls 6.

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    • I like that the writers wrote out the two 'teams' in fairly realistic ways. There is no Black and White when dealing with people, there are always pros and cons to most groups - which makes you have to really think ...weigh the options.

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    • Seatrout00 wrote:
      I like that the writers wrote out the two 'teams' in fairly realistic ways. There is no Black and White when dealing with people, there are always pros and cons to most groups - which makes you have to really think ...weigh the options.

      ... what about black people and white people, they're black and white... god that was just a terrible joke, I probably shoudln't even post it... NAH.

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    • You know anyone can delete that, right?

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    • yeah, I know, if you want to it's okay, I just felt like making a bit of a joke, it sounded a bit racist before I posted, but if someone gets offended I wont be mad if it's removed.

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    • RedAngel34 wrote: Stormcloaks did what they felt was right. To allow someone to govern your heritage is not the way. Ulfric Stormcloak arrogant? Not necessarily. He is however confident that he can defeat the Thalmor. The only way we are going to know if either side can beat the Thalmor is if Bethesda(?)Games makes an Elder Scrolls 6.

      I think that Stormcloaks just have a misunderstanding with the Empire. They think Talos worship is actually going to be forever. The Empire is just complying with the Dominion until they can overthrow them. The Dominion knows this, and that is why they were going to spring Ulfric at Helgen. That would keep the war going, so the Empire would keep spending troops instead of preparing for war with the Dominion.

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:

      RedAngel34 wrote: Stormcloaks did what they felt was right. To allow someone to govern your heritage is not the way. Ulfric Stormcloak arrogant? Not necessarily. He is however confident that he can defeat the Thalmor. The only way we are going to know if either side can beat the Thalmor is if Bethesda(?)Games makes an Elder Scrolls 6.

      I think that Stormcloaks just have a misunderstanding with the Empire. They think Talos worship is actually going to be forever. The Empire is just complying with the Dominion until they can overthrow them. The Dominion knows this, and that is why they were going to spring Ulfric at Helgen. That would keep the war going, so the Empire would keep spending troops instead of preparing for war with the Dominion.

      There's also the fact that the Empire allows the Thalmor to just send justicars to abduct anyone they believe to be Talos Worshippers (read: don't like)

      as long as the Empire allows Thalmor to roam freely in Skyrim, they are allowing the Thalmor to systematically kill off the Nords they see as a threat.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:

      Goldflame33 wrote:

      RedAngel34 wrote: Stormcloaks did what they felt was right. To allow someone to govern your heritage is not the way. Ulfric Stormcloak arrogant? Not necessarily. He is however confident that he can defeat the Thalmor. The only way we are going to know if either side can beat the Thalmor is if Bethesda(?)Games makes an Elder Scrolls 6.

      I think that Stormcloaks just have a misunderstanding with the Empire. They think Talos worship is actually going to be forever. The Empire is just complying with the Dominion until they can overthrow them. The Dominion knows this, and that is why they were going to spring Ulfric at Helgen. That would keep the war going, so the Empire would keep spending troops instead of preparing for war with the Dominion.

      There's also the fact that the Empire allows the Thalmor to just send justicars to abduct anyone they believe to be Talos Worshippers (read: don't like)

      as long as the Empire allows Thalmor to roam freely in Skyrim, they are allowing the Thalmor to systematically kill off the Nords they see as a threat.

      Which should be none, but the Stormcloaks are closed-minded and stuck in the past.

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    • Goldflame33 wrote:

      Pink Slim wrote:

      Goldflame33 wrote:

      RedAngel34 wrote: Stormcloaks did what they felt was right. To allow someone to govern your heritage is not the way. Ulfric Stormcloak arrogant? Not necessarily. He is however confident that he can defeat the Thalmor. The only way we are going to know if either side can beat the Thalmor is if Bethesda(?)Games makes an Elder Scrolls 6.

      I think that Stormcloaks just have a misunderstanding with the Empire. They think Talos worship is actually going to be forever. The Empire is just complying with the Dominion until they can overthrow them. The Dominion knows this, and that is why they were going to spring Ulfric at Helgen. That would keep the war going, so the Empire would keep spending troops instead of preparing for war with the Dominion.
      There's also the fact that the Empire allows the Thalmor to just send justicars to abduct anyone they believe to be Talos Worshippers (read: don't like)

      as long as the Empire allows Thalmor to roam freely in Skyrim, they are allowing the Thalmor to systematically kill off the Nords they see as a threat.

      Which should be none, but the Stormcloaks are closed-minded and stuck in the past.

      (READ: DON'T LIKE)

      They abduct ANYONE they don't like, whether or not they are a Talos Worshipper or not.

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    • Empire, for many reasons. 1) A united Empire is better in the long run and is FEARED by the Dominion. 2) if i remember currectly Ulfric is basicly a sleeper agent for the Thalmor read the dossiar you get after you sneak into the embassy. 3) even if they are curropt curroption doesnt last forever the Empire can solve there problems after the war.


      Just my opinion tho.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Goldflame33 wrote:

      Pink Slim wrote:


      Goldflame33 wrote:

      RedAngel34 wrote: Stormcloaks did what they felt was right. To allow someone to govern your heritage is not the way. Ulfric Stormcloak arrogant? Not necessarily. He is however confident that he can defeat the Thalmor. The only way we are going to know if either side can beat the Thalmor is if Bethesda(?)Games makes an Elder Scrolls 6.

      I think that Stormcloaks just have a misunderstanding with the Empire. They think Talos worship is actually going to be forever. The Empire is just complying with the Dominion until they can overthrow them. The Dominion knows this, and that is why they were going to spring Ulfric at Helgen. That would keep the war going, so the Empire would keep spending troops instead of preparing for war with the Dominion.
      There's also the fact that the Empire allows the Thalmor to just send justicars to abduct anyone they believe to be Talos Worshippers (read: don't like)

      as long as the Empire allows Thalmor to roam freely in Skyrim, they are allowing the Thalmor to systematically kill off the Nords they see as a threat.

      Which should be none, but the Stormcloaks are closed-minded and stuck in the past.
      (READ: DON'T LIKE)

      They abduct ANYONE they don't like, whether or not they are a Talos Worshipper or not.

      well, the dragonborn tends to massacre everyone they dont like, so... your point is null.

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    • Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      Goldflame33 wrote:

      Pink Slim wrote:


      Goldflame33 wrote:

      RedAngel34 wrote: Stormcloaks did what they felt was right. To allow someone to govern your heritage is not the way. Ulfric Stormcloak arrogant? Not necessarily. He is however confident that he can defeat the Thalmor. The only way we are going to know if either side can beat the Thalmor is if Bethesda(?)Games makes an Elder Scrolls 6.

      I think that Stormcloaks just have a misunderstanding with the Empire. They think Talos worship is actually going to be forever. The Empire is just complying with the Dominion until they can overthrow them. The Dominion knows this, and that is why they were going to spring Ulfric at Helgen. That would keep the war going, so the Empire would keep spending troops instead of preparing for war with the Dominion.
      There's also the fact that the Empire allows the Thalmor to just send justicars to abduct anyone they believe to be Talos Worshippers (read: don't like)

      as long as the Empire allows Thalmor to roam freely in Skyrim, they are allowing the Thalmor to systematically kill off the Nords they see as a threat.

      Which should be none, but the Stormcloaks are closed-minded and stuck in the past.
      (READ: DON'T LIKE)

      They abduct ANYONE they don't like, whether or not they are a Talos Worshipper or not.

      well, the dragonborn tends to massacre everyone they dont like, so... your point is null.

      well put.

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    • WarMos wrote:
      Empire, for many reasons. 1) A united Empire is better in the long run and is FEARED by the Dominion. 2) if i remember currectly Ulfric is basicly a sleeper agent for the Thalmor read the dossiar you get after you sneak into the embassy. 3) even if they are curropt curroption doesnt last forever the Empire can solve there problems after the war.


      Just my opinion tho.

      1, the empire is being forced to kill off many able bodied soldiers because they fear the dominion.

      2, no, that's just wrong.

      3, do you know how most corrupt governments have given up corruption? with internal wars. Remove who's incharge and replace them with people who want to improve the government for their people.

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    • yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 

        Loading editor
    • Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      Empire, for many reasons. 1) A united Empire is better in the long run and is FEARED by the Dominion. 2) if i remember currectly Ulfric is basicly a sleeper agent for the Thalmor read the dossiar you get after you sneak into the embassy. 3) even if they are curropt curroption doesnt last forever the Empire can solve there problems after the war.


      Just my opinion tho.

      1, the empire is being forced to kill off many able bodied soldiers because they fear the dominion.

      2, no, that's just wrong.

      3, do you know how most corrupt governments have given up corruption? with internal wars. Remove who's incharge and replace them with people who want to improve the government for their people.

      1) because of the stormcloaks!

      2) it isnt, it almost comes right out and says he is.

      3) I personally dont think the empire IS corrupt. weakened, but not corrupt... you DO know how the great war started and ended, right? if the empire didnt surrender, you just want them to be massacred? I dont think you quite understand what would have happened.

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    • I know that the Empire didnt really have a choice. Surrender was one option amoung many and taking back the imperial city cost them a lot of good men and women.

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    • Basicly there choices were fight and hope for a victory or live and fight another day.

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    • WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 

      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)

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    • exactly the definition of sleeper agent is doing something the another group wants you to do with our without knowlage of the agent. They implanted a long standing hatred of the High Elves and feelings of betrayal from the Empire he loyaly served. Because they surrendered instead of fighting till the last.

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    • WarMos wrote:
      exactly the definition of sleeper agent is doing something the another group wants you to do with our without knowlage of the agent. They implanted a long standing hatred of the High Elves and feelings of betrayal from the Empire he loyaly served. Because they surrendered instead of fighting till the last.

      no, he's not a sleeper agent, they know what kind of person he is, they're just trying to guide him in the direction that they want him to. they know what he's like, so they try to modify the world around him to limit his options, and if he gets into power they will not be able to do this.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)

      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

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    • Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      The Civil War had been going on for a while before he killed Toryyg, and why did he kill Toryyg? because Toryyg was nothing but a puppet in his eyes; Yes it's possible for there to have been a peaceful way to achieve his goals, but the Thalmor wouldn't allow that, They led Ulfric to believe that he was the reason they took the Imperial city, even though he hadn't broken until after The Imperial Forces had taken back the city; they warned him that he would be considered a traitor to all people if they "revealed this information" and there would be no way for him to negotiate seccetion as long as the Thalmor are guiding the Empire.

        Loading editor
    • Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      (king, as opposed to simply independance. he didnt just want independance, but he wanted independance AND to be king, which is a purely selfish desire.)

        Loading editor
    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      The Civil War had been going on for a while before he killed Toryyg, and why did he kill Toryyg? because Toryyg was nothing but a puppet in his eyes; Yes it's possible for there to have been a peaceful way to achieve his goals, but the Thalmor wouldn't allow that, They led Ulfric to believe that he was the reason they took the Imperial city, even though he hadn't broken until after The Imperial Forces had taken back the city; they warned him that he would be considered a traitor to all people if they "revealed this information" and there would be no way for him to negotiate seccetion as long as the Thalmor are guiding the Empire.

      1) where the hell did you get your information?

      2) now whos playing into the thalmors hands?

        Loading editor
    • Cerithrose wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      (king, as opposed to simply independance. he didnt just want independance, but he wanted independance AND to be king, which is a purely selfish desire.)

      He's the only one who is trying to lead Skyrim against the Thalmor, the only other one who was trying was forced to resign by the empire; Skyrim must be led by someone who has the courage to stand against the Thalmor and the Empire who is doing nothing but helping them.

        Loading editor
    • Yes the Mede Empire is week and maybe they dont deserve to rule skyrim but that does not mean that Ulfric should as he is selfish, racist jarl who only wants the throne for himself and uses the ban of Talos worship as his cause to fight. The cause maybe noble but Ulfric is not. Think about it when the dragon attacked did the Stormcloaks fight to save all the inocent people no instead Ulfric told them to run, they fled because Ulfric was scared, I thought Nord warriors always fought.

      Plus he is to arrogant to realize that this war is what the Thalmor want, The Empire is not the enemy the Thalmor are. The Thalmer want The Empire and The Stormcloaks to fight so that they are both weak for when The Thalmor come to attack.

      But this does not mean that The Empire is good, Emperor Titus Mede II is a coward and would let The Thalmor ban the worship of Talos the founder of the Empire hero so great he became an Aedra, a god. As well as let The Thalmor hunt down and kill almost every single member of The Blades a faction that has been extremely loyal to The Empire since the Remen Dynasty.

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    • 109.158.74.98 wrote:
      Yes the Mede Empire is week and maybe they dont deserve to rule skyrim but that does not mean that Ulfric should as he is selfish, racist jarl who only wants the throne for himself and uses the ban of Talos worship as his cause to fight. The cause maybe noble but Ulfric is not. Think about it when the dragon attacked did the Stormcloaks fight to save all the inocent people no instead Ulfric told them to run, they fled because Ulfric was scared, I thought Nord warriors always fought.

      Plus he is to arrogant to realize that this war is what the Thalmor want, The Empire is not the enemy the Thalmor are. The Thalmer want The Empire and The Stormcloaks to fight so that they are both weak for when The Thalmor come to attack.

      But this does not mean that The Empire is good, Emperor Titus Mede II is a coward and would let The Thalmor ban the worship of Talos the founder of the Empire hero so great he became an Aedra, a god. As well as let The Thalmor hunt down and kill almost every single member of The Blades a faction that has been extremely loyal to The Empire since the Remen Dynasty.

      Obviously he wants the throne, but he also wants to destroy the aldmeri dominion, expecially the thalmor, and reinstate worship of talos, why else would he have taken out the Forsworn?

      He knows the Thalmor are the true enemy, but the Thalmor are using the Empie as a weapon, and he can't just avoid the Empire and go straight for the dominion as long as The Dominion has control of the Empire.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      (king, as opposed to simply independance. he didnt just want independance, but he wanted independance AND to be king, which is a purely selfish desire.)
      He's the only one who is trying to lead Skyrim against the Thalmor, the only other one who was trying was forced to resign by the empire; Skyrim must be led by someone who has the courage to stand against the Thalmor and the Empire who is doing nothing but helping them.

      Ulfric's a bigot and a powermonger willing to manipulate the prejudices of fellow Nords and sacrifice the innocent of other races as convenient targets while looking only for personal gain.

      Seems everyone who is siding with the Stormcloaks because the Imperials were going to execute them should know that if you followed Hadvar at the beginning you get attacked shortly after by a group of Stormcloaks who want to kill you for no reason at all.

        Loading editor
    • TheGreenSabre wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      (king, as opposed to simply independance. he didnt just want independance, but he wanted independance AND to be king, which is a purely selfish desire.)
      He's the only one who is trying to lead Skyrim against the Thalmor, the only other one who was trying was forced to resign by the empire; Skyrim must be led by someone who has the courage to stand against the Thalmor and the Empire who is doing nothing but helping them.
      Ulfric's a bigot and a powermonger willing to manipulate the prejudices of fellow Nords and sacrifice the innocent of other races as convenient targets while looking only for personal gain.

      Seems everyone who is siding with the Stormcloaks because the Imperials were going to execute them should know that if you followed Hadvar at the beginning you get attacked shortly after by a group of Stormcloaks who want to kill you for no reason at all.

      I've played both sides, and I even sided with the empire on my first character because I was told the Stormcloaks are racists, not only did I find that the empire was basically only attacking the stormcloaks because they're afraid of the Thalmor, they are wasting soldiers fighting possible allies in the oncoming war, but their officials are assholes who don't even care about the people or the country they're "defending" they're just trying to rid anything that the thalmor might attack them over. They are cowards with power, nothing more.

      Ulfric might be a bigot/power monger, but atleast he's doing the right thing; he's fighting for his people, for what they want, what did the empire do? they gave away a part of a country and sent a legion and their best military mind to kill some people that are doing what the empire should be doing, defending their people from the threat that they're facing, right now it's the empire, next it's going to be the dominion; but what does the empire say when they win? they're looking to force Morrowind, home of the Dunmer who they abandoned, back into their empire.

        Loading editor
    • Pink Slim wrote:

      109.158.74.98 wrote:
      Yes the Mede Empire is week and maybe they dont deserve to rule skyrim but that does not mean that Ulfric should as he is selfish, racist jarl who only wants the throne for himself and uses the ban of Talos worship as his cause to fight. The cause maybe noble but Ulfric is not. Think about it when the dragon attacked did the Stormcloaks fight to save all the inocent people no instead Ulfric told them to run, they fled because Ulfric was scared, I thought Nord warriors always fought.

      Plus he is to arrogant to realize that this war is what the Thalmor want, The Empire is not the enemy the Thalmor are. The Thalmer want The Empire and The Stormcloaks to fight so that they are both weak for when The Thalmor come to attack.

      But this does not mean that The Empire is good, Emperor Titus Mede II is a coward and would let The Thalmor ban the worship of Talos the founder of the Empire hero so great he became an Aedra, a god. As well as let The Thalmor hunt down and kill almost every single member of The Blades a faction that has been extremely loyal to The Empire since the Remen Dynasty.

      Obviously he wants the throne, but he also wants to destroy the aldmeri dominion, expecially the thalmor, and reinstate worship of talos, why else would he have taken out the Forsworn?

      He knows the Thalmor are the true enemy, but the Thalmor are using the Empie as a weapon, and he can't just avoid the Empire and go straight for the dominion as long as The Dominion has control of the Empire.

      Titus Mede II was a good Emperor, but he only had power for months before the Thalmor invaded Cyrodiil.

      Although it is not well known, Summerset Isle suffered from the Oblivion Crisis as much as Cyrodiil did. The elves fought war upon the Oblivion invaders, occasionally even crossing over to close down Oblivion gates. As a kingdom they had more successes than Cyrodiil did, although the limitless Daedric hordes made the outcome a foregone conclusion. United as one, The Empire/Hammerfell can defeat the Dominion.

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    • TheGreenSabre wrote:

      Pink Slim wrote:

      109.158.74.98 wrote:
      Yes the Mede Empire is week and maybe they dont deserve to rule skyrim but that does not mean that Ulfric should as he is selfish, racist jarl who only wants the throne for himself and uses the ban of Talos worship as his cause to fight. The cause maybe noble but Ulfric is not. Think about it when the dragon attacked did the Stormcloaks fight to save all the inocent people no instead Ulfric told them to run, they fled because Ulfric was scared, I thought Nord warriors always fought.

      Plus he is to arrogant to realize that this war is what the Thalmor want, The Empire is not the enemy the Thalmor are. The Thalmer want The Empire and The Stormcloaks to fight so that they are both weak for when The Thalmor come to attack.

      But this does not mean that The Empire is good, Emperor Titus Mede II is a coward and would let The Thalmor ban the worship of Talos the founder of the Empire hero so great he became an Aedra, a god. As well as let The Thalmor hunt down and kill almost every single member of The Blades a faction that has been extremely loyal to The Empire since the Remen Dynasty.

      Obviously he wants the throne, but he also wants to destroy the aldmeri dominion, expecially the thalmor, and reinstate worship of talos, why else would he have taken out the Forsworn?

      He knows the Thalmor are the true enemy, but the Thalmor are using the Empie as a weapon, and he can't just avoid the Empire and go straight for the dominion as long as The Dominion has control of the Empire.

      Titus Mede II was a good Emperor, but he only had power for months before the Thalmor invaded Cyrodiil.

      Although it is not well known, Summerset Isle suffered from the Oblivion Crisis as much as Cyrodiil did. The elves fought war upon the Oblivion invaders, occasionally even crossing over to close down Oblivion gates. As a kingdom they had more successes than Cyrodiil did, although the limitless Daedric hordes made the outcome a foregone conclusion. United as one, The Empire/Hammerfell can defeat the Dominion.

      I will agree that Tirus mede II did do what he thought was correct, but he settled to the AD's demands too easily, he did what he thought was best, but he could have done better.

      as I said earlier in this thread:

      I commend him for his effort, but condem him for the failure.

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    • Pink Slim wrote:
      TheGreenSabre wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      (king, as opposed to simply independance. he didnt just want independance, but he wanted independance AND to be king, which is a purely selfish desire.)
      He's the only one who is trying to lead Skyrim against the Thalmor, the only other one who was trying was forced to resign by the empire; Skyrim must be led by someone who has the courage to stand against the Thalmor and the Empire who is doing nothing but helping them.
      Ulfric's a bigot and a powermonger willing to manipulate the prejudices of fellow Nords and sacrifice the innocent of other races as convenient targets while looking only for personal gain.

      Seems everyone who is siding with the Stormcloaks because the Imperials were going to execute them should know that if you followed Hadvar at the beginning you get attacked shortly after by a group of Stormcloaks who want to kill you for no reason at all.

      I've played both sides, and I even sided with the empire on my first character because I was told the Stormcloaks are racists, not only did I find that the empire was basically only attacking the stormcloaks because they're afraid of the Thalmor, they are wasting soldiers fighting possible allies in the oncoming war, but their officials are assholes who don't even care about the people or the country they're "defending" they're just trying to rid anything that the thalmor might attack them over. They are cowards with power, nothing more.

      Ulfric might be a bigot/power monger, but atleast he's doing the right thing; he's fighting for his people, for what they want, what did the empire do? they gave away a part of a country and sent a legion and their best military mind to kill some people that are doing what the empire should be doing, defending their people from the threat that they're facing, right now it's the empire, next it's going to be the dominion; but what does the empire say when they win? they're looking to force Morrowind, home of the Dunmer who they abandoned, back into their empire.

      For the Imperials, by ignoring the rebellion would destabilize Skyrim. Thalmor can use their Navy to invade from the north. As for the Morrowind unification, Morrowind needed the Empire's goods, without them, the Dunmer will be jobless, and as bad as the Argonian dock workers.

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    • really? invade from the north? which countries would allow the Thalmor to move a navy around their shores so they can go all the way to Skyrim? they're not coming from the west without having to deal with Hammerfell and Highrock(who are possibly still aligned with the Empire) They would have to come from the east, which means they would have to pass by Argonia, which might be considered an act of agression by moving such a large fleet by their shores, and with their ability to breath water they would make short work of the aldmeri fleet; then there's also the Dunmer, who they have never gotten along with, also the fact that they would be somewhat near the red mountain, which is spewing molten rocks all the way to solstheim, you think they would call that a safe path?

      There is no way The Aldmeri Dominion can get a fleet all the way to skyrim's shores without the Nords being prepaired for the assault, anyone who believes that has no idea what they're talking about.

      Now onto unifying with Morrowind. Jobless? In need of the Empire's goods? They've been seperated from the Empire since the Oblivion Crisis, they have stabalized since then, and if the empier wanted to take back Morrowind as a show of good faith, they would have done something about the Argonian invasion. They don't care about the Dunmer, they just want more soldiers, and they're too busy killing them in skyrim.

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    • Any invading Dominion fleet would sink long before seeing Skyrims shores.

      Were would AD captains learn to sail in it's treacherous waters?



      They'd suffer the same fate the the Spanish Armada did if they tried.

      In fact, I hope they do.

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    • TheGreenSabre wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      TheGreenSabre wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Cerithrose wrote:
      Pink Slim wrote:
      WarMos wrote:
      yes i know how must curroption is solved its been awhile since i read the dossiar but i beleive they want let Ulfric escape after he was a prisioner 
      yes, they wanted him to survive so that the war can continue, so that more men and women die without possibly losing any of their own troops, this would have been impossible if The Empire let the Stormcloaks secede and let the Thalmor attack them, the Thalmor would have to lose soldiers while battling the stormcloaks, which is something they don't want(because Elves breed and mature slower than men, so they would have to wait much longer for new/combat ready soldiers)
      and the empire MIGHT have let him seccede, if he tried the diplomatic approach. if he had negotiated a compromise.

      so what did he do? he murdered the high king. then you expect them to let him seccede? why didnt he just talk it out? oh, wait, I know: its because he WANTED to be king, and thats the only reason!

      (king, as opposed to simply independance. he didnt just want independance, but he wanted independance AND to be king, which is a purely selfish desire.)
      He's the only one who is trying to lead Skyrim against the Thalmor, the only other one who was trying was forced to resign by the empire; Skyrim must be led by someone who has the courage to stand against the Thalmor and the Empire who is doing nothing but helping them.
      Ulfric's a bigot and a powermonger willing to manipulate the prejudices of fellow Nords and sacrifice the innocent of other races as convenient targets while looking only for personal gain.

      Seems everyone who is siding with the Stormcloaks because the Imperials were going to execute them should know that if you followed Hadvar at the beginning you get attacked shortly after by a group of Stormcloaks who want to kill you for no reason at all.

      I've played both sides, and I even sided with the empire on my first character because I was told the Stormcloaks are racists, not only did I find that the empire was basically only attacking the stormcloaks because they're afraid of the Thalmor, they are wasting soldiers fighting possible allies in the oncoming war, but their officials are assholes who don't even care about the people or the country they're "defending" they're just trying to rid anything that the thalmor might attack them over. They are cowards with power, nothing more.

      Ulfric might be a bigot/power monger, but atleast he's doing the right thing; he's fighting for his people, for what they want, what did the empire do? they gave away a part of a country and sent a legion and their best military mind to kill some people that are doing what the empire should be doing, defending their people from the threat that they're facing, right now it's the empire, next it's going to be the dominion; but what does the empire say when they win? they're looking to force Morrowind, home of the Dunmer who they abandoned, back into their empire.

      For the Imperials, by ignoring the rebellion would destabilize Skyrim. Thalmor can use their Navy to invade from the north. As for the Morrowind unification, Morrowind needed the Empire's goods, without them, the Dunmer will be jobless, and as bad as the Argonian dock workers.

      Thalmor navy, there's a laugh.

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    • 80.216.214.210 wrote:
      Any invading Dominion fleet would sink long before seeing Skyrims shores.

      Were would AD captains learn to sail in it's treacherous waters?



      They'd suffer the same fate the the Spanish Armada did if they tried.

      In fact, I hope they do.

      MAGICKA!THIS IS ALDMERIS!

      The suckers could use some of their arcane knowledge now and then,couldn't they?

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    • Interesting, what would you have had the Empire do differently?, rewinding back to the final days of the Great War, just before the signing of the Concordat?

      The Dominion would need a fleet not only large enough to transport tens of thousands of soldiers but also large enough to carry provisions for the weeks that it would take to make landfall. An invading fleet also can't exactly make landfall at the docks of Solitude, Dawnstar or Windhelm and we know how treacherous the rock lined coastline can be to making safe landfall for even one ship let alone dozens of them. There is also of course the problem of maintaining a supply line for an army of that size. The Empire had similar problems in Akavir and the overall results were disastrous. Getting to Skyrim isn't quite the easiest way. But with the Empire weakened, who knows what they would do.

      Morrowind does need The Empire at this time especially against the Thalmor, When you take the Rift during the Civil War questline, Morrowind may have not officially down anything, but the Legion wants to be positioned there just encase they need to invade and take control back. There's a Dunmer Legate named Sevan Telendas in Winterhold.

      Cyrodiil is now like a fortress, the Legions are all stationed along the Aldmeri Dominion's border. Cyrodiil has spent the last 30 years rebuilding and regaining strength, nearly the entire Imperial Army is located within Cyrodiil. The Empire is more than likely weakest in High Rock and Skyrim, with the Legions in Skyrim struggling to put down the rebellion, being forced to recruit locally. All the strength of the Empire is now within Cyrodiil preparing for a war. Attacking prepared Imperial Legions will not be an easy feat, the Dominion already learned the lesson of The Battle Of The Red Ring when the Legions were mobilized together, just like they are now. This proved that the Legion still strong enough to do two things at a time, fighting the Stormcloak rebels and guarding the capital from those evil elves.

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    • Sky Above,Voice Within wrote:
      80.216.214.210 wrote:
      Any invading Dominion fleet would sink long before seeing Skyrims shores.

      Were would AD captains learn to sail in it's treacherous waters?



      They'd suffer the same fate the the Spanish Armada did if they tried.

      In fact, I hope they do.

      MAGICKA!THIS IS ALDMERIS!

      The suckers could use some of their arcane knowledge now and then,couldn't they?

      The Dominion gained the allegiance of the Khajiit by using dawn magicks to bring back the moons. Conjuration; They could conjure spectral ships.

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    • the WGC? no way, I'd go back even further, back to the oblivion crisis, the first thing I would have NOT done, is pulled back all Legionnaires. maybe a large amount of them, but never would I leave all the provinces defenseless, look what happened to Morrowind, less than thirty years had passed since Morrowind officially joined the Empire, then what happens, they pull out and let them deal with the Daedra on their own, and when that was dealt with they didn't even send the troops back, they just let the Argonians bulldoze through Morrowind.

      next I would have sent diplomats to speak with the Aldmeri Dominion about their secession, possibly talk them down from secceding. If that was not possible and we got closer to when the war started I would have actually done what the Dominion demanded and remove all the blades agents from the summerset Isles.

      If it got to the point where I was negotiating in the White-Gold Tower to sign the White-Gold Concordant I would have tried to lower their tearms, I wouldn't have just blindly agreed to them the way Titus Mede II did. I would NOT have given them part of hammerfell; but I probably would have let them take Talos off the Official Pantheon; HOWEVER I would NEVER let them send their Justicars to freely pluck out people from their homes.


      And It's almost a fact that The Thalmor did NOT return the moons; they just did what they did with the Oblivion Crisis and took the credit.

      And let them Conjur Ships, just need one person to banish the ship and they all fall into the sea and are easy pickings.

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    • Imperials. at level 46+ its possible to get 2 deadric swords enchanted for free!

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